The HDRkid Thread

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That means a 15" speaker will start to distort at around 50Hz no matter what, and then the popular 18" speaker will go lower and be a truer response, then back in the '70's you could buy a 30" Electrovoice speaker

Ruthless,

Of course you'll have distortion if you have an 18" speaker at 50 Hz. The problem is harmonics. An 18" speaker won't handle a 50 Hz output without distortion. An 18" speaker is .441 meters. A 50Hz signal has a wavelength of 6,000 km. The speaker doesn't efficiently handle a full wavelength. Give the output enough power and you have distortion that isn't associated with the physical characteristics of the speaker (what the speaker is made from). There is no harmonic that can be evenly divided by both .441 meters and 6,000 meters nor can it be divided by a common natural log of .441 and 6,000 - and that is distortion (wave interference). Crank up the volume and you'll eventually hear the problem (or the speakers will blow up
).
 
I am not sure what that Electrovoice 30" speaker would handle but looking at another website with *.pdf files for old speakers and such stuff, it usually was something like 250 watts with peaks to 1000 watts, which still for the time is not all that much. But compare to looking up JBL and see that now professional speakers go around 600 watts and well the entire cabinet can handle up to 3200 watts peak. I just sit here and be amazed, because my JBL are really kind of old with paper cones and handle 150 watts with 600 watts peak so just one side handles about 265 watts with peaks accordingly. I do not know, since I use to use them but built the cabinets and they need kind of repair work since I put the duct for the woofer in the back for more surround type sound. And anyway, I guarantee that you would not want them that loud for your TV movies in the place that you live. I have an old NAD amp that puts out 40 watts but peaks at 260 watts and after awhile that is even loud, but was something new when surround sound movies came out on tapes. But anymore, even DVD movies only have hi-fi sound instead of also the mono type sound one can set with a VHS recorder which is good enough for me, since with movies they include all of the sound with everything going on including explosions and whatever. After awhile even Star Wars gets old with surround sound and putting up with all that sound.

The headphones (which I just bought new ones - Bose - which don't seem as good as my old ones that rattle now on one side) typically only handle 100 milliwatts of power so at what they claim is something like 10-40000Hz frequency response is only the total of what they will handle, but typically the real response is good enough, just like speakers that claim they handle 20Hz to 20000Hz, but when looking at the fine print it is typically + or - 10dB or more, and even in the good range usually + or - 3dB or even around 6dB.

Everything in sound has sound characteristics even microphones some of which like ribbon mics sound better usually take less over total power (blow out easier) but good enough to be used for like symphony recordings or orchestra recordings then on to dynamic mics which handle more power but usually sound different or not at good as ribbon microphones. It all costs money, and a lot of money can be spent on that stuff.

Usually the speaker will be the weak link of a sound system and that is why they still try and create different type of speakers like they do, but in the end, the efficiency is still weak and it is a piston and mechanical movement device, except when they use like a horn speaker with its radially designed curve whatever you call it, exponential curve I guess and then the throat of the diaphram they use is way smaller and the horn makes the loudness for the sound but then it sounds like a horn also which sounds like a horn which is more efficient but still sounds like a horn, which a lot of people do not like. It just ends up being cheaper I guess. I sure one can look up sound arrays in various buildings they have put in because they end up taking measurments and everything of the room characteristics that also add to the sound in the end. I remember one, maybe Carnegie Hall perhaps which is on the Internet or something like that and the entire type of the stage area all way across was nothing but array after array of speaker banks in the building which is I guess around at least 50 feet across, but with stacks of speakers way up high hanging there and directed to cover the entire room.

It gets quite involved just to put up speakers in a football or baseball stadium and run 70 volt lines with a room of amplifiers usually put in and the 70 volt lines ran out throughtout the stadium. Just can not run speaker wire with a setup like that. And then they usually are using horn speakers but then it is not a full-range speaker system but more a PA system still using a lot of amplifier power though.
 
the amount of audible distortion in a jl audio 15w3 @1500w rms is much, much less than 1%. thats close enough for me.
sure sounded like perfection. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
I just sit here and be amazed, because my JBL are really kind of old with paper cones and handle 150 watts with 600 watts peak so just one side handles about 265 watts with peaks accordingly.

That your speakers can handle that output is great! Your speakers are rated at 600 W but you max them at 150 W...well within the design limit. When they design excellent speakers they design them so that they can handle an output that is greater than what you would really want. That's why a speaker might be rated to handle 10 Hz/600W. You can't really hear 10 Hz (though you might feel it) but because the speaker is designed to handle 10 Hz it can reproduce 27 Hz well within it's design limit. The same goes at the top end. A speaker that is rated to output 30-40 KHz, which is well beyond the top end for most people, can easily handle 20 kHz at the same wattage.

We pay for the excellence - which is why I prefer Bose. Bose speakers are expensive (boy, howdy are they expensive!) but even at the lowest volume they effiectively reproduce the studio input.
 
i cant stand bose, or any home stereo product for that matter, but hey, thats just me. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

im a car audio nut. much stronger suff. i'd love to see a bose take 1500w rms. heck, i'd like to see a bose even be able to go 1 ohm :D
 
We pay for the excellence - which is why I prefer Bose. Bose speakers are expensive (boy, howdy are they expensive!) but even at the lowest volume they effiectively reproduce the studio input.

Amen to that, brutha Darby! I am also a Bose customer...loyal one at that, for the same reason of design excellence. In the above you've shown you understand frequency response topics very well. Myself being a control system design engineer, you are no doubt aware of how important frequency response (and designing a system with the correct FR!) is to what I do. I am constantly amazed and ecstatic with the "magic" of the frequency domain as the perfect reflection of the TIME domain.

In fact, it is my belief that those folks who believe in the romantic notion of TT (which I think is not possible) could seriously benefit from studying and understanding LaPlace transforms, Fourier transforms, and the latest Wavelet transforms. For the mathematics of these transforms completely describe the alignment of time response with frequency response of any physical system (which is described by Energy).

Knowledge of this (frequency) math, and the fundamentals of physical energy, are what makes me confident in my prediction that TT, when it occurs, will not in any way look like the romantic interpretation all the stories write about... namely, the idea you keep your body intact as you travel through time. I am quite sure TT will have to manifest as a spread-spectrum effect. That means Frequency Response, not its inverse Time, is the best way to analyze and design a Time Machine.

In fact, I will make a prediction right here in HDRKid's thread! I predict that once someone designs a working TT machine, the entire engineering design will not only be able to be mathematically described via Frequency Response, but that the key aspect of the design of ANY TT machine will be a major new technological revelation about how the Universe works. IOW, it will be a major advancement in Physics... and new math that describes it (already in the wings) will describe it.

RMT
 
only an idiot would buy 7000 dollar speaker wire lol.

but ol' jl's are something uncompareable. a subwoofer really cannot do its job without a box of some sort. with that being said...

you compare a jl audio subwoofer without a box to an expensive subwoofer WITH a box. thats how much difference it is. buy any sub or sattelite speaker from jl and i guarantee you that you will have it, and still love it like its gold for the next 50 years. to give you an even better idea of how good they are, ill tell you this, im drooling at the thought of hearing a jl in a decent box... gawd i hate being poor!!!! :oops:
 
Hi Ridata:

You said
I have heard it all now. Lowered testosterone???

T the wonder hormone. In addition to increasing lean muscle and lowering body fat, it makes you feel confident, energetic, and bullet proof.
Unfortuneatly I jumped from a high place and injured my ankle so I have not been posting. T and reckless behavior go together.


Hi Timenot:
Thanks for the ATS link.

It said
1. The elections this year will be delayed
2. A major catastrophic event will be taking place in our country?

Actually, day before yesterday an RVer gave me some scary info on the future.
 
Hi Ridata:

You said
I have heard it all now. Lowered testosterone???

T the wonder hormone. In addition to increasing lean muscle and lowering body fat, it makes you feel confident, energetic, and bullet proof.
Unfortuneatly I jumped from a high place and injured my ankle so I have not been posting. T and reckless behavior go together.

Okay. first would like to say, I have Bose speakers for the computer and they were only 99.00. I think that's cheap, for the sound they produce. they are itty bitty but sound better than most big speakers.

Alright, back to the thread, since HDR kid is back. I'm not correlating how an injured ankle prevents online activity but OK.

That said, HDRkid, its amazing to me how you respond to people. For example, you completely avoid the argument (er, discussion) that I made regarding testosterone. Not only did you totally evade it as if you didn't really read it, you then go on to espouse the wonders of "T." Surely you would know, that if I am aware of the effects of lowered testosterone, then I am also aware on the effects it has on the body, period. So, do not patronize me as you do all the posters here with your railroading responses. Either address the questions or challenges presented to you when you are incorrect about a subject, or at least acknowledge it. This is why I got so frustrated with you in the past, you play these games on here and then continue to post your dooms-day scenarios.

No wonder the topic has gone to music and the output of speakers. A subject I don't much get into but infinitely more interesting than yours. I mean, you post that an RV told YOU scary news, but nothing about your jumps that caused you to sprain your ankle?

Oye. I am bored with you HDRkid.
 
Ruthless,

BTW: In this case I don't mind that we've hijacked The Kid's thread. The Kid has a bad habit of thread hijacking that goes way back.

(Not to mention that the Kid can't resist responding to this post. Donuts to dollars?)
 
It seems to be "do or die" for HillBilly in the coming weeks...eh?

Or will the NWO intervene at the last minute and "crown" Hillary Kin... uhhh... Queen?

Get your chips and dip and drinks together for the thrilling conclusion, fans! It's down to the last 8 months of the election now!

Many things will be answered in the coming weeks.... ooooh....ahhhhh.

RMT
 
yeah, i apologize for the thread hijacking, but its not like anything important was going on. :D

i would like to make a few quick points about bose speakers. they are paper speakers in plastic boxes for ridiculous amounts of money. they sound like junk plain and simple. if you want a beautiful sounding setup, come to me and ill save you tons. you want the strongest speakers(paper speakers are a joke) at least made out of polypropeline, you want the most linear travelling speakers, you want high excursion, and you suredly do not want a plastic box. i have owned bose speakers before in both wooden and plastic boxes. they are garbage.

if a speaker company does not tell you any tech. specifications to a speaker, thats the fist sign of its wrongdoings. i know why bose does it, if you have a choice between a speakers that can handle 50w rms and one is 20 bucks and the other is 250, well, most people are going to choose the 20 dollar speaker. and they would be right for doing so. the funny thing is that the 20 dollar speaker is usually better made and definitely not paper.

the only positive thing about a bose speaker is its sensitivity, wich comes from the use of paper and foam surrounds. this reduces the weight of the moving peices and increases sensitivity. the downside is that it sacrifices quality of sound. bose fans will love to argue this by saying it sounds wonderful. any correctly set up stereo sounds "good," but to achieve legendary sound, and dependability, you need more rigid stuff. buy a lil better amp, and sensitivity matters no more. i dont care too much for listening to music at 10 watts. the strongest, most linear speaker will always sound best. linear is a word bose knows nothing about. dont believe me? lets test it out. go buy a 50w rms amplifier and a cheap 20 dollar speaker of the same size as your bose. turn the 50w amp to max at full pass, and your bose speaker starts to distort terribly, especially at the lower hz. now take the elcheapo and put it into the bose box. you will instantly notice more powerful sound and you will also notice that the plastic box is making a god awful noise. thats because the poor plastic box flexes an ungodly amount. i have done this experiment and i can say the bose lasted approx. 1.5 secs before it popped from 100w rms and the elcheapo started distorting at 100w rms.

okay! enough about speakers. i know im driving yall nuts with it lol. kinda like an addiction though. :D

back to the wonders of hdr! wait, thats really boring, and fake... crap... oh well. :D
 
To Ruthless:
SAY WHAT?

To Risata:
As I said before, the interest is in preventing future wars. It seems that low T makes you very unaggressive. Sadly, most time trme travellers tend to be the young reckless high T types. Notice that most wars are fought by young men, however if you lower T not only are people less aggro, they are also less adventurous.

That said my favorite TV comment was by Obama's wife who said she thought her husband was a nerd. Urkel for president. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif


To Darby:
You know what, I went to see a hockey match and a fight broke out.

It is just like a nasty ndebunker to high jack a time travel thread in time travel claims and start talking about speakers to get the thread moved.
/ttiforum/images/graemlins/mad.gif
 
ruthless,

See what I mean? The Kid couldn't resist. I must be a time traveler because I made a specific prediction and it came to pass.
 
"It is just like a nasty ndebunker to high jack a time travel thread in time travel claims and start talking about speakers to get the thread moved."

sorry about that 'ol hdr. but, why am i nasty, and how did i get that way? i said i was willing to try hdr out. if you were going to let a nut like robbie borrow your hdr, why wont ya let me borrow it?!

i dont mind trying hdr out, but i do mind paying outrageous prices for something that costs 6 bucks to make. ask people around here, i am a pretty credible person, and i am a fair person. let me use the machine and i will post non biased results, no matter what.

but i do find it hilarious that you took all that time to avoid the questions i asked, just to get rude when you think ive highjacked your thread.
 
but i do find it hilarious that you took all that time to avoid the questions i asked, just to get rude when you think ive highjacked your thread.

When I posted the comment it was meant to be ironic. In fact, you didn't hijack The Kid's thread at all. That's because this isn't The Kid's thread. It's Ray's. The Kid hijacked it a long time ago.
 
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