Rusty;
Again I do appreciate you unswayable stance.
So ignoring my grammer, let's proceed. I don't know about you, but I am enjoying this very harsh debate.
Again, i shall requote you for clarification.
"I'm surprised you are saying that my argument is based solely on the language issues. Interesting thing to say given at most points it's near the end of my posts."
No, actually, you bring it up at several points in each and every entry. (enough said there)
"What happened to dealing with the contradictions?"
There are no contradiction in what I've written, only what you perceive as being a contradiction beased upon your predispostion. As is evidenced in my answers, you make an assumption, assume it as afactual, and then cry nay at it based upon your translation, not what I've said.
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As is ecvidenced by this:
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""I am here to learn about the brain can as much as I can"
Wait, hold on... lemme get this straight...
Time-Travelling man travels back in time to get a time-travelling (or surely 'experiencing'?) device. Why would a person with the capability to time-travel already need a device that will probably do the job far less effectively?"
Here's why you cannot see my particular lines of reasoning, you are confusing them with your own, and those of others.
I never said that the brain can I was searching for had anything to do with time travel, nor did I insinuate it. You drew that assumption based upon your point of view. In actuality, it is the next generation of how computers are to be built, and how we, as humand, shall interact with them. You subjectively filled in informatin based upon what you felt i was, or should be, saying, not upon what I said.
""Has somebody asked me my birthdate and I missed it?"
You certainly seem keen to supply us with vague details on it before hand."
So you accuse me of being UNABLE to supply my birthdate, but yet you admit that nobody has asked, not even yourself. In your critical thinking, have you not come across the idea that calling foul to somebody on an imagined point is not critical or logical, but merely a form of aggressive stance?
""So what tense do I use?"
You would use present tense as the time-frame (regardless of what time) is always the present for you - as it's what you are experiencing . 'What will happen'. As, even if it has happened for you, there is no way for you to say that it won't happen again for you (IE you are abandoned here) - as you say, paradoxes aren't possible (otherwise we would have had the issue of you existing with yourself). So present my good friend."
D'accord, Mon Ami! the present tense it is: I am born in the year 1969 and I am being recrutied in 1989 by an odd group of lunars. I am in your future, and here in your present, and am doing several jobs so that I will be helping them today 9which is actually 300 years or so from now)
WOW! I like my text better. My past is your future, but then again my future is your past. We share a common past, but it is out of synch...I'll refer to your NOW as my personal now, my subjective past (as long as it take place in your persoanl past) as the past; and everyting that happens ahead of your personal now as the future, although it may have occured in my past.
...long discussion of the Civil war (whihc we are bothin agreement on by the way) not addressed...more for the reason of keeping htis fun debate going by not showing that we actualyl agree on somehting than anything else....
"For a Time-traveller with issues over what tense to use to describe events, you have a pretty clear-cut answer for that question. So, in 1969, when you were born (lot of 9s aren't there?), you reckon that Korean war was not history, even though it happened before you were born?"
How many nine's do you want? I'm counting two 9's right now...the year I was born, and the year I was recruited....how many are you counting?
By proxy, I'll concede with your point. The korean war is a group of events, and it did influence other events. However, tose groups of events are history, not the name for those events. that is a question of semantics, not of truth. so I'll conced your point, although you must understand that I do not think of such things in the same manner that you do.
On historians:
"I thought you said you couldn't spare any operatives? 'What purpose could they serve?' - well, fairly easy actually. They could observe. I bet there a large number of historians who want to go back in time to see what really happened. Excellent. You now have observationalists!"
And likewise, there are a large number of historians that would be missed in liner time, which would mean far too much attention. Historians that are objective are extremely rare, and then having to force them to re-learn events form several different time constructs would be a difficult chore, as it is much harder to unlearn, and then relearn than it is to simply learn.
"They could go back in time to observe... What they already friggin know! So why would you need to observe anything, if you already know "
You, of course, assume the stance that time (as you perceive it) is static and unchanging. and further, your statement here contradicts your previous one. If an historian already knows, then why would they ever want to go back in time and experience it as it already happened?
"So then you must be lying (or misdirecting, if you so prefer) about observing. Your actions are certainly inconsistant to that effect (is it really neccessary to have people who want to interfere with time to observe?)."
Really? My actions are not consistent? What have I done? How do you know? Again, you are assuming a posture of stoic 'factuality' as you perceive it, and your philosophy shall not and will not accomidate anything contrary to the set of ideas that are, to you, facts. I can do my job in this era, and observe unrelated events to whatever ends I need to. I am sorry that you feel that whether or not you had eggs or pancakes for breakfast, the choice of supporting Manchester Untied or another soccer team this week, and the experiemnt running in your lab are all interrelated.
You are again assuming the idea that I am singular in my purpose and that I am far too much an imbecile to watch one chain of events, whilst I later act on others.
From your stance, everything I might say, even if it is the truth, will be perceived from your viewpoint as a lying. I have no need to convince you. In fact, it would do me good to find someone that I cannot possibly convince. I wrote my final message yesteday, but it would lend lots of credence if I could find somebody that aboslutely has the opinion that I am a fraud (and all the others that replied to me privately in regards to being time travelers or poser's need not apply) to my ultimate goal of being here on this website.
""My subject area, as you so named it, is not even America"
So your currency of choice is the American dollar, but you don't know anything about America, even though that's the economy you are effectively riding on in order to gain cash. Interesting tactics. Are money issues in the future normally this well thought out? Probably no surprise you need a fund-raiser..."
This is very rich, very verboose, and is more like 'grasping at straws' than being an observation.
I repeat: AS YOU SO NAMED IT.
Now, for a moment, pretend that you can step outside of your box that is flooded with unacceptance and prejudice. Whom would yo urecruit to work in America, a Danish lady from the 1800's, a Hun, somebody from South America in the 210's, or an American from the same era (give or take 50 years)?
In the future, per se, there ar eno money issues. The reich controls it, and they simply take what they want. The rest have to scramble for crumbs. When I say that I am a fund raiser, that is a bit misleading. of course, your assumptions are based upon a banal understanding of raising monies, which is not the entire case. Money is easy to acquire, just check your archaelogical records for unusal finds and you'll see how easy it is. A clay bowl that is worthless a thousand years ago, is worth a fortune in this era.
Likewise, gold futures purchased 4 years ago are worth more than double what they are in this today.
No genius required!
I am an American, but I have no intense or intimate knowledge of anything about Americana beyond what is taught in most high schools twenty of your years ago. it is not needed, and the idea that I need to know about who said what, at what moment, and to whom will have a direc tbearing upon how much money I am supposed to inves tinto gold futures, is beyond my understanding. To me, it simply does not matter. I do not need to know all of the details behind the internal cobusiton automobile to put the key in and drive it. Likewise, I do not need to be advancely versed in the concepts of science, physics, stinrg theory, and quantum mehcanics, as well as each and every detail of hwat happened at each moment in every part of this nation 9becaus ei am in it right now it it THIS nation), to cash in on Microsoft stocks.
"My only question is who would refuse to fund all this in the first-place? 'We're planning to avert disaster for the human race'. I can't imagine what the reply would be like... Yeah, I'd love to, but, you know, I actually enjoy all this wasteland!"
Firstly, this is not your only question, this is your fifth!
And I NEVER said that I was looking for investors, you assumed that from your predisposition, and perhaps the coments of others; but I never said so much or even intimated it. Funds are monies, resources, and supplies of various kinds. I acquire those wihtout having to pull the far too curious into the loop.
You again took the stance that I was looking for inversotrs. I never said anything in support of that, and it is mererly a fabrication of yours used to support your own arguments.
Investors do not panout in the long term. Likewise, you assume that I am merely speaking about money. There are more things in this world, in any time, than money.
"And no, I don't hold stereotypes for guessing what nationality someone is... given you yourself say that you are born in America, and...
"However, the American language "
Would imply both that you're American, and would suggestively imply that I also use, given you were commenting on the corrections as being part of the 'American' language. Surprise, just Standard English for myself. Although I don't take it upon myself to correct slang-differences. Ization and Isation both still read the same, for example."
And thank you for illustating my point. I DO speak american, and you do not. Two peoples seperated by dialects. then again, you refer to American as slang, whilst the English choose to mispronounce words such as SHIRE as SHEAR. Now if we could toss a Canadian of this era (with their rather obtuse method of speaking) we could all three be equally confused by what the other is saying.
"Personally, I'd use time-travel to sway the arguments. If you know what your opponent says, you could counter it before it's even been written! Although this would lend very obvious support to your argument that you can time travel. And hey presto, you can beat everything I've said! But you haven't, so never mind."
This is excellent! you of course assume that I have an infernal here somewhere in my pocket! You also assume that tha ttravelling through time is the equivalent of flippijng a light switch. It isn't! Likewise, you assume tha tany time traveller would use there meothods to persuade otheres....this is simply inane. What could I gain? Possibly some infinite debate on the internet likened to the hallowed and false prophet John Titor, possibly my own cult of yeah-sayers? If I were here to acheive stardom and a fan base, I would have ready proof availabel that would become the hallmark of controversy.
Also, you must understand that those that use time travel ar eusually the targets of anyone else that is also using it. hence why the Lunars live such a short life. If you were to use time travel fo ryour own perosnal gain, you would enjoy a great life through your personal manipulation. This would be short lived, as you would become a thrat to the reich, to the othe rlunars, and to us.
and i haven't? Of course i haven't! I am not here to jump through your hoops, I am here to do a job and then report.
AS wizards of the past are assumed to be the illusionists of your today, the self-made gods of your tomorrow are assumed to be the Lunars of your future.
The path of serving only onesself spirals ever downward....and aside from that, if I directly influenced my entries here, it would nullify our bet.
"If that was true, it would be more likely you would have sent 'Thugs' after me to just eliminate me entirely and stop that from even possibly occuring"
Here's some breaking news for you...for the most part they don't like me! I think that they are a callous gang of ruffians...ill-educated (even to me) , and crass. I have no authority to send them anywhen. And if I did, why would I chance the waste of energy to frag another idle dissenter? This era need lots of people like you, those firm in their beliefs (based upon whatever they hodl to be true) for us to do what we do. If the whole world suddenly looked around intently and took notice, keeping an eye out fro travellers, agents, muses, and thuggies, they would catch on. For us, this would mean diaster. We don't need those that hide under their covers chanting "there's no such tings as ghosts", we need those that wish to believe but cannot.
"Then again, how do you know that by coming back in time, you are causing your future to happen?"
I do not. Any changes in the stream that occur when I anm in the stream effect me as much as anyone else. When I am gapped (having jumped form one time to another) I have my memories, and they remain intact in my memory, but are germaine to the era I am experiencing as my now. My personal past is my own, and there is sometimes some fallout, but my now is as subject to change as yours is.
"Strange. I don't remember instantly growing up and aging."
How is it in your brain? Is it a chronological order, meaning that you have to start at second one, and then move forward to experience it anew, or is it a an event that you can bring up at will? You hold all of your personal past in you rmind of experience to be brought in an instant, but yet you cannot conceive fo the actual experience being the same? So then, either your brain is wired incorerctly, or your perception of time is. By your definition, there can be no compromise betwixt the two. Either you start at the beginniong and move forward, or you can jump about it at will. which is it? If time is truly linear, then you must, by definition, start at the beginning and move forward. If you can insert your being into any given point, then it is not linear. You have no problem with recalling an event in the past at the speed of thought and reliving it, but you cannot see how that might apply to things that you are not yet aware of.
Just because all things happen at the same moment inthe same time does not mean that we perceive it thusly. With your illustrated knowledge can you not admit that our perceptions are primitive and very limited?
On your ecelelnt argument against my example of white light:
Yes, true, very interesting. It does not change the fact that perception and reality are different things and that all the advanced ideas that describe reality (in an attempt to make it become our perspective) do not change the fact that is, simply is.
"The great decendants of the people who lived in the basements. Now I worry about our future."
If what I say makes you fret over the future, just look at those in their twenties today! undeucated, non-caring, desiring comfort above justice....keep in mind tha tin your twilight hours that they will be running the world.
I weep for your future.
On the thuggies:
"What might that involve? Saving people? Killing? (Probably that's all it does involve)."
The thiggies are the elite group of operatives that change the scene after those such as myself set it up. They are not above saving, nor are they above killing. They are a particular breed that I feel border upon the sociopathic. Usually a muse is called in shortly after they've operated to draw attention away from what they've done. they do save. they do kill. But they also do do othe rthings that defy definition for a simple debate.
""I very much enjoy the Lemming remark."
Called 'Appeal to Common Practices'. If you got some spare time, you should look it up. "
Again you assume that I have no intelelct, or at least knowledege of basic psycholgy. I do realize that I have done nothing to demonstrate this, and have actually said things that have a negative impact on this idea.
So then I ask you...if everyone claims that time travel travel is not possible, would you agree?
Of course, at this juncture, you shall appeal to common practices and say no. you will give me al sorts of reasons, such as how the universe is moving, and the boundaries that really aren;t there, and such. But again, Mr. Rusty Lemming, which is it? do you appeal to your common practices, or not?