Is it true, Pamela?
- Thread starter CatJammin
- Start date
ruthless
Rift Surfer
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
"Walking distance? LOL!! Darby lives in California and I live in Ohio.
That would be one heck of a walk!"
never said that, i said both of your i.p.'s are based in VA, and i find that strange, thats all. maybe if folks werent so secretive, i wouldnt have to do so much thinking on my own...
"Walking distance? LOL!! Darby lives in California and I live in Ohio.
That would be one heck of a walk!"
never said that, i said both of your i.p.'s are based in VA, and i find that strange, thats all. maybe if folks werent so secretive, i wouldnt have to do so much thinking on my own...
Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
Ruthless,
Oh, boy.
The IP resolved to Reston, Va because I logged in on one of my systems that uses Verizon DSL. Verizon's hub is in Reston, VA. Any Verizon DSL customer will have a Whois resolve to Reston, VA.
Pamela is on AOL. All AOL users' IP's will resolved to Manassas, VA. That's where AOL's hub is located. With AOL you'll also see more than one user with the same IP. AOL's IP's are dynamic. AOL users don't have a unique static IP.
Pamela is in Ohio. I'm in Southern California.
____________________________________
BTW: I wsn't being secretive when I made the post about Javier. I've stated in several posts that Titor/Time_Travel_0's multiple IP's are known to at least a half dozen people.
Remember, he did use the Internet. The sites that he chose to post on did not, at that time at least, show the members' IP's. The post simply said "IP Logged". The TOS agreements for those sites, again - at that time, included a statement that the SysAdmin would not reveal the IP to anyone not specifically authorized to view the information. I don'tknow how TTI was set up in-so-far as Mod rights were. But the mods can usually click on the "IP Logged" hypertext and reveal the IP. There were a couple of Mods here and on Post-2-Post in 2000-2001 in addition to the SysAdmins.
And there's your hint...IP Logged. And because the story got so "big" the logs were saved.
Titor usually logged in via a proxy and masked his real IP. "Usually"is the important word there. He failed to spoof his IP a few times. And when that occured his real IP was logged - and that IP was shared by a regular member on that site.
Now, the SysAdmin/Owners won't reveal the information to you. But if you are really curious and you just have to have the information there is a way to get it - legally and without violating the original TOS agreement. Just buy the sites and you will have it all.
What sites did Titor log onto? Well, you know of at least four.
You know about Art Bell's site Post-2-Post. It shut down a few weeks after Titor stopped posting. As far as I know Art and Premiere Radio own the rights. At least four people there had access to the IP logs.
There's this site. The owner is Raul Burriel.
The other two sites were:
The Peanut Gallery (www.pn3.com?) - something like that. I don't recall the URL. It no longer exists.
The other site is the one where he had the IRC conversation with MysticWarrior. She's never told me what that site was.
As I said, the information is there. Titor was not "anonymous" to the SysAdmin on The Site. And Titor was not Javier.
Obviously, I've had the opportunity over the years to talk to one or more of the half dozen people who have the specific knowledge and was able to gather some details. But because of the TOS agreement the "fine details" of the issue are not for public consumption.
But if you owned the site then it would be your choice as to how to proceed, yes?
The point of all of this isn't that I expect you to try to buy this or any of the other sites. That won't be cheap.
The point is that there's really no secret about Titor's identity - it is discoverable. But no site owner really wants to tickle the dragon's tail by disclosing the information covered under TOS just to see if a lawyered up Group Titor would actually sue them.
As an aside, this situation is a part of how little sense the "I need to remain anonymous to protect myself and my family from the big bad government" ploy makes.
The information is there. If the big bad government was really interested in the Titor Saga it wouldn't need a search warrant, it wouldn't need a court order and it wouldn't need a subpeona duces tecum. All it would need is a telephone, a checkbook and one agent. It could just have someone play "John Q Citizen Website Investor" to play the buyer, buy the site and be done with it.
Ruthless,
Oh, boy.
The IP resolved to Reston, Va because I logged in on one of my systems that uses Verizon DSL. Verizon's hub is in Reston, VA. Any Verizon DSL customer will have a Whois resolve to Reston, VA.
Pamela is on AOL. All AOL users' IP's will resolved to Manassas, VA. That's where AOL's hub is located. With AOL you'll also see more than one user with the same IP. AOL's IP's are dynamic. AOL users don't have a unique static IP.
Pamela is in Ohio. I'm in Southern California.
____________________________________
BTW: I wsn't being secretive when I made the post about Javier. I've stated in several posts that Titor/Time_Travel_0's multiple IP's are known to at least a half dozen people.
Remember, he did use the Internet. The sites that he chose to post on did not, at that time at least, show the members' IP's. The post simply said "IP Logged". The TOS agreements for those sites, again - at that time, included a statement that the SysAdmin would not reveal the IP to anyone not specifically authorized to view the information. I don'tknow how TTI was set up in-so-far as Mod rights were. But the mods can usually click on the "IP Logged" hypertext and reveal the IP. There were a couple of Mods here and on Post-2-Post in 2000-2001 in addition to the SysAdmins.
And there's your hint...IP Logged. And because the story got so "big" the logs were saved.
Titor usually logged in via a proxy and masked his real IP. "Usually"is the important word there. He failed to spoof his IP a few times. And when that occured his real IP was logged - and that IP was shared by a regular member on that site.
Now, the SysAdmin/Owners won't reveal the information to you. But if you are really curious and you just have to have the information there is a way to get it - legally and without violating the original TOS agreement. Just buy the sites and you will have it all.
What sites did Titor log onto? Well, you know of at least four.
You know about Art Bell's site Post-2-Post. It shut down a few weeks after Titor stopped posting. As far as I know Art and Premiere Radio own the rights. At least four people there had access to the IP logs.
There's this site. The owner is Raul Burriel.
The other two sites were:
The Peanut Gallery (www.pn3.com?) - something like that. I don't recall the URL. It no longer exists.
The other site is the one where he had the IRC conversation with MysticWarrior. She's never told me what that site was.
As I said, the information is there. Titor was not "anonymous" to the SysAdmin on The Site. And Titor was not Javier.
Obviously, I've had the opportunity over the years to talk to one or more of the half dozen people who have the specific knowledge and was able to gather some details. But because of the TOS agreement the "fine details" of the issue are not for public consumption.
But if you owned the site then it would be your choice as to how to proceed, yes?
The point of all of this isn't that I expect you to try to buy this or any of the other sites. That won't be cheap.
The point is that there's really no secret about Titor's identity - it is discoverable. But no site owner really wants to tickle the dragon's tail by disclosing the information covered under TOS just to see if a lawyered up Group Titor would actually sue them.
As an aside, this situation is a part of how little sense the "I need to remain anonymous to protect myself and my family from the big bad government" ploy makes.
The information is there. If the big bad government was really interested in the Titor Saga it wouldn't need a search warrant, it wouldn't need a court order and it wouldn't need a subpeona duces tecum. All it would need is a telephone, a checkbook and one agent. It could just have someone play "John Q Citizen Website Investor" to play the buyer, buy the site and be done with it.
ruthless
Rift Surfer
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
"Indeed I find Pam to be a very open woman. Quite considerate and indulging of the varity of questions I have asked her."
i agree that she has been very open. but some things seem very, very strange. i'm not accusing anyone of anything. but i think its very obvious that she couldve been in on the plot. i'm not saying that she was, only that she couldve been.
another thing is, when i started getting to the bottom of the titor story, pamela and darby both decided not to answer key questions, and i understand why. but i am also sure that they know what it looks like too.
i'll put it like this, if the titor story was a hoax, he was a physisist, an engineer, and either a very bored person, or a very intelligent person trying to make a big buck. just so happens that we have a physisist, and engineer and a very bored/extremely intelligent person on this site.
it is also known that darby and pamela have titor stuff that noone has ever seen. i sometimes wonder why they keep it secret, then i think maybe they are trying to make a buck off it, then it makes sense. i also wonder why pamela would not tell us her profession.
pamela and darby have always been polite, and all- around nice folks. i respect them alot, but, to me, theres alot of unanswered questions.
"Indeed I find Pam to be a very open woman. Quite considerate and indulging of the varity of questions I have asked her."
i agree that she has been very open. but some things seem very, very strange. i'm not accusing anyone of anything. but i think its very obvious that she couldve been in on the plot. i'm not saying that she was, only that she couldve been.
another thing is, when i started getting to the bottom of the titor story, pamela and darby both decided not to answer key questions, and i understand why. but i am also sure that they know what it looks like too.
i'll put it like this, if the titor story was a hoax, he was a physisist, an engineer, and either a very bored person, or a very intelligent person trying to make a big buck. just so happens that we have a physisist, and engineer and a very bored/extremely intelligent person on this site.
it is also known that darby and pamela have titor stuff that noone has ever seen. i sometimes wonder why they keep it secret, then i think maybe they are trying to make a buck off it, then it makes sense. i also wonder why pamela would not tell us her profession.
pamela and darby have always been polite, and all- around nice folks. i respect them alot, but, to me, theres alot of unanswered questions.
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
If the Goverment was really after Titor, and they saw him as a threat of somekind. They would have got him. Considering that he appears as most time travelers do on this site and many others (wack job). I don't think no goverement body gives a [censored].
If someone really did prove they travel through time, and I mean they were able to predict things right on the nose with dates of events. What I mean is someone in the year 200O showed up online and foretold things like 911, tsunami in Indonesia, Iraq war, Bush winning 2 elections with dates of celebrities dying. ECT ECT ECT.
I am sure the Goverment and MSN would read these boards everday and track these people down.
I am not convinced any persons on this fourm or any others is the real deal. I would love to know that time travel is real.
If the Goverment was really after Titor, and they saw him as a threat of somekind. They would have got him. Considering that he appears as most time travelers do on this site and many others (wack job). I don't think no goverement body gives a [censored].
If someone really did prove they travel through time, and I mean they were able to predict things right on the nose with dates of events. What I mean is someone in the year 200O showed up online and foretold things like 911, tsunami in Indonesia, Iraq war, Bush winning 2 elections with dates of celebrities dying. ECT ECT ECT.
I am sure the Goverment and MSN would read these boards everday and track these people down.
I am not convinced any persons on this fourm or any others is the real deal. I would love to know that time travel is real.
TheCigSmokingMan
Rift Surfer
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
Ruthless,
Excusing my sarcasm, that's what I was trying to get at... /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Is Pamela an unwitting "pawn" or member of "Group Celebration, Fl" <Group "Titor">
It is clear from the photos, logos and manuals that several people were involved.
I wasn't around in the beginning to know Pamela's role.
I'm still puzzled by the "John Titor" confirmations supposedly given to Pamela.
At this point in the saga, I see no reason to hold on to this information.
Given this "British Airforce" officer revelation, I find it less than "believable" but someone could have pretended to be from the British Airforce | Intelligence and contacted Pamela via private message.
It only prolongs any lingering doubts that the "John Titor" is a complete hoax purportedly conducted by a group that resides/or resided in Celebration, Fl.
TheCigMan
Ruthless,
Excusing my sarcasm, that's what I was trying to get at... /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Is Pamela an unwitting "pawn" or member of "Group Celebration, Fl" <Group "Titor">
It is clear from the photos, logos and manuals that several people were involved.
I wasn't around in the beginning to know Pamela's role.
I'm still puzzled by the "John Titor" confirmations supposedly given to Pamela.
At this point in the saga, I see no reason to hold on to this information.
Given this "British Airforce" officer revelation, I find it less than "believable" but someone could have pretended to be from the British Airforce | Intelligence and contacted Pamela via private message.
It only prolongs any lingering doubts that the "John Titor" is a complete hoax purportedly conducted by a group that resides/or resided in Celebration, Fl.
TheCigMan
ruthless
Rift Surfer
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
one more thing while im thinking about it. you state that titor used the same i.p. as a member of this site at least once. well then, you know that it wouldnt take me very long at all to find that. so, the way i see it, theres four options. a, you dont want to say anything for fear of something coming out about you, which i highly doubt. b, you are putting me on a wild goose chase that will never end to misdirect me. c, you want me to figure it out. and d, you have signed a non-disclosure act.
i would be willing to bet its c, but not sure. so i have two questions for you. the obvious first:
which one is it? a,b,c,d, or the magical e?
and you know when i find it, im going to post it. are you ok with that?
and finally, i want to say to both pamela and darby, these posts are in no way, shape, or form an attack. i respect both of yall greatly, and i feel like these are innocent questions.
i have most of the story figured out, i am just missing a few pieces.
i know that most, if not all of this has been said before, and i apologize for beating a dead horse...
one more thing while im thinking about it. you state that titor used the same i.p. as a member of this site at least once. well then, you know that it wouldnt take me very long at all to find that. so, the way i see it, theres four options. a, you dont want to say anything for fear of something coming out about you, which i highly doubt. b, you are putting me on a wild goose chase that will never end to misdirect me. c, you want me to figure it out. and d, you have signed a non-disclosure act.
i would be willing to bet its c, but not sure. so i have two questions for you. the obvious first:
which one is it? a,b,c,d, or the magical e?
and you know when i find it, im going to post it. are you ok with that?
and finally, i want to say to both pamela and darby, these posts are in no way, shape, or form an attack. i respect both of yall greatly, and i feel like these are innocent questions.
i have most of the story figured out, i am just missing a few pieces.
i know that most, if not all of this has been said before, and i apologize for beating a dead horse...
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
I wonder what it is that you think I have kept hidden from you Ruthless?
The only thing I have kept secret about John is info that I can use to verify to myself that
I am again talking to the same person who called himself "john Titor."
If I gave out that info it would become useless to me.
He may decide to come forward some day and I will have the info I need to verify him.
I'm sorry but I am not giving that up.
To answer Eric's question: No, I don't believe it like I once did. The primary reason(there are other reasons as well) is the absolute refusal of the "mother" to answer the one question I have been asking her for years.
"Where is the departure video?" It was written in the book that she had sent it out to the individuals who were suppose to receive it. The other question was "why can't another one be sent?"
After years of not receiving an answer and being rudely ignored I have come to the conclusion one does not exist. That it must have been a hoax that got big and someone tried to make money from it.
But there are some things that happened that still remain somewhat of a mystery to me that cause me to wonder still.
I wonder what it is that you think I have kept hidden from you Ruthless?
The only thing I have kept secret about John is info that I can use to verify to myself that
I am again talking to the same person who called himself "john Titor."
If I gave out that info it would become useless to me.
He may decide to come forward some day and I will have the info I need to verify him.
I'm sorry but I am not giving that up.
To answer Eric's question: No, I don't believe it like I once did. The primary reason(there are other reasons as well) is the absolute refusal of the "mother" to answer the one question I have been asking her for years.
"Where is the departure video?" It was written in the book that she had sent it out to the individuals who were suppose to receive it. The other question was "why can't another one be sent?"
After years of not receiving an answer and being rudely ignored I have come to the conclusion one does not exist. That it must have been a hoax that got big and someone tried to make money from it.
But there are some things that happened that still remain somewhat of a mystery to me that cause me to wonder still.
Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
ruthless,
That much is very unlikely - and it may be the only part fo the Titor Saga that was real. he said that he wasn't a physicist.
His science and engineering, in the story, was really, really bad. He borrowed bits and pieces from a few pop-sci physics books that were on the bookshelves at the time but that's about the extent of his knowledge.
ruthless,
That much is very unlikely - and it may be the only part fo the Titor Saga that was real. he said that he wasn't a physicist.
His science and engineering, in the story, was really, really bad. He borrowed bits and pieces from a few pop-sci physics books that were on the bookshelves at the time but that's about the extent of his knowledge.
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
Darby,
I have to ask. Are you just taking this persons word that says he knows about John's IP?
Or have you been shown some kind of actual proof?
By the way the only places I know John posted was Time travel institute and Art bell.
The only places he chatted was in MSN chat rooms and whatever mysticwarrier chatted on.
That other web site(www.pn3.com) was the place that a certain poster posted stuff about John but it was not John.
John even mentioned this somewhere in the threads. It was posted when John was still posting.
I can't think of his name right now. You know the guy who stole that "got light? make matter" saying from me. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
I think he even still posts here once in a while.
Darby,
I have to ask. Are you just taking this persons word that says he knows about John's IP?
Or have you been shown some kind of actual proof?
By the way the only places I know John posted was Time travel institute and Art bell.
The only places he chatted was in MSN chat rooms and whatever mysticwarrier chatted on.
That other web site(www.pn3.com) was the place that a certain poster posted stuff about John but it was not John.
John even mentioned this somewhere in the threads. It was posted when John was still posting.
I can't think of his name right now. You know the guy who stole that "got light? make matter" saying from me. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
I think he even still posts here once in a while.
Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
ruthless,
It's not a wild goose chase and I'm not putting you on. The information can be had but for a price. For me it's just another Internet TT saga - though it is body, head and shoulders above the "Once Every Two Weeks" TT stories that we have seen since 2001. But it is still a form of inconsequential entertainment. I'm not curious enough to spend $100 let alone $20k to $25k to find the answer. (Those are real numbers, not numbers that I just made up, BTW)
But I didn't sign a non-disclosure contract. Like the person(s) with whom I was in contact, I too am a forum administrator. If I were to violate a significant privacy TOS agreement on that person's site then the people on my site with whom I have similar agreements under TOS would have no reason to think that I wouldn't also violate their privacy TOS agreements on Anomalies. Very bad for business not to mention reputation.
I know that people get frustrated when yet another yahoo with a silly TT story and a cloaked IP comes along. I get the same on Anomalies - and on Anomalies I have access to the uncloaked IP and email addy because of the requirements for registering. But I don't disclose even if the person is an absolute fool who would piss off the Pope Himself.
(And besides - its all entertainment. Where'sthe fun in having the answer to a mystery dumped in your lap without any grunt work being done?
)
I've tossed this bone out there for those who just have to know the answer.
ruthless,
It's not a wild goose chase and I'm not putting you on. The information can be had but for a price. For me it's just another Internet TT saga - though it is body, head and shoulders above the "Once Every Two Weeks" TT stories that we have seen since 2001. But it is still a form of inconsequential entertainment. I'm not curious enough to spend $100 let alone $20k to $25k to find the answer. (Those are real numbers, not numbers that I just made up, BTW)
But I didn't sign a non-disclosure contract. Like the person(s) with whom I was in contact, I too am a forum administrator. If I were to violate a significant privacy TOS agreement on that person's site then the people on my site with whom I have similar agreements under TOS would have no reason to think that I wouldn't also violate their privacy TOS agreements on Anomalies. Very bad for business not to mention reputation.
I know that people get frustrated when yet another yahoo with a silly TT story and a cloaked IP comes along. I get the same on Anomalies - and on Anomalies I have access to the uncloaked IP and email addy because of the requirements for registering. But I don't disclose even if the person is an absolute fool who would piss off the Pope Himself.
(And besides - its all entertainment. Where'sthe fun in having the answer to a mystery dumped in your lap without any grunt work being done?
I've tossed this bone out there for those who just have to know the answer.
Re: Royal Airforce contact me about John
"$20k to $25k to find the answer. (Those are real numbers, not numbers that I just made up, BTW)"
John's information is worth that much money??!!
Hmmmm....~Pamela sits down and thinks about the new car she would like to have!~ lol /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif kidding.
"$20k to $25k to find the answer. (Those are real numbers, not numbers that I just made up, BTW)"
John's information is worth that much money??!!
Hmmmm....~Pamela sits down and thinks about the new car she would like to have!~ lol /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif kidding.