Greetings from a Parallel Earth *DELETED*
- Thread starter churchhead
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Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Solar powered tractors? To till the land? Le'see - if your tractor has virtually 100% efficient solar panels, about two square meters of them, you'll generate, oh 300 watts. Enough to light three 100 watt light bulbs for 24 hours. How much does that tractor weigh and how many acres of dirt mass does it bust up per day? Even if the electric motor outputs zero heat loss and converts all 300 watts to useful work? On rainy days does it have a wind power conversion kit?
In your self described 18th Century farm co-op society do they teach basic physics in school? Ever think about using an ox to pull the tractor? They eat a lot of food and output a ton of ox crap but you can always use the dried crap to make a fire in the fireplace.
And speaking of crap...
Solar powered tractors? To till the land? Le'see - if your tractor has virtually 100% efficient solar panels, about two square meters of them, you'll generate, oh 300 watts. Enough to light three 100 watt light bulbs for 24 hours. How much does that tractor weigh and how many acres of dirt mass does it bust up per day? Even if the electric motor outputs zero heat loss and converts all 300 watts to useful work? On rainy days does it have a wind power conversion kit?
In your self described 18th Century farm co-op society do they teach basic physics in school? Ever think about using an ox to pull the tractor? They eat a lot of food and output a ton of ox crap but you can always use the dried crap to make a fire in the fireplace.
And speaking of crap...
Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Why even in their completely different world of spirituality and everlasting peace where indiviiduality appears to be a sin they not only use the same King;s English - they even use the same idioms. Imagine that.
"I'm afraid to say". An English idiom that defies transliteration. Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the many world universe, s/he walks into mine speaking local English. Go figger.
Why even in their completely different world of spirituality and everlasting peace where indiviiduality appears to be a sin they not only use the same King;s English - they even use the same idioms. Imagine that.
"I'm afraid to say". An English idiom that defies transliteration. Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the many world universe, s/he walks into mine speaking local English. Go figger.
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
1) You assert there was never a Catholic Church
2) There then was no Church sponsored trade with the Far East
3) There were no rats brought back to Europe from Asia
4) There was no Bubonic Plague
4) There was no massive die out in England
5) There was no Great Vowel Shift, which defined the beginning of Modern English
6) Henceforth, thou shaltest speak in olde english.
1) You assert that you had no industrial revolution.
2) None of the technology you are describing is possible.
1) You assert that you live in small communities, that are generally isolated
2) You assert you live a closed circuit society that is under a single religion with no defined borders.
3) You assert borders and religion cause war.
4) You should have no war
5) Communications technology was a developed in wartime for war purposes.
6) You should have no communications technology
7) You assert you have a global government
8) You assert these government oficials are democratically elected
9) Democratic Global elections and global governance would be impossible without a vast communications infrastructure
10) Therefore, your government is impossible.
1) You assert there was no Catholic Church, which you have determined was the conversion of Constantine to Christianity on his deathbed
2) Christians continue to be persecruted, until they are extinct without the support of Roman.
3) Next would fall judaism and Islam without the strong wall the Catholics provided between the German invaders and the Palestinians.
4) Ultimately without Catholic defense The Norwegians would have conquered England, and been able to spread to mainland europe
5) The remaining religions are Norse, Hindu, various German tribal religions, and Eastern Mythos.
6) The Norse and Germans would clash
7) The germans would be able to hold back due to there home feild advantage
8) Eastern Invaders like Genghis Khan would easily crush the germans
9)The main super powers of the world would now be The Mongols, India and the Norse.
10) Norse and chinese would clash, Mongols would win and ultimately destroy the Norse.
11) India falls
12) Africa is not advanced enough to defend against the mongols, and is conquered.
13) The entire old world is controlled by the war hungry mongols.
14) You assert that this Somehow transforms into a utpoian society.
15) I assert you're a person from this universe who didnt quite remember the Mongols when you decided that it'd be a good idea to remove the Catholic church from history.
1) You assert there was never a Catholic Church
2) There then was no Church sponsored trade with the Far East
3) There were no rats brought back to Europe from Asia
4) There was no Bubonic Plague
4) There was no massive die out in England
5) There was no Great Vowel Shift, which defined the beginning of Modern English
6) Henceforth, thou shaltest speak in olde english.
1) You assert that you had no industrial revolution.
2) None of the technology you are describing is possible.
1) You assert that you live in small communities, that are generally isolated
2) You assert you live a closed circuit society that is under a single religion with no defined borders.
3) You assert borders and religion cause war.
4) You should have no war
5) Communications technology was a developed in wartime for war purposes.
6) You should have no communications technology
7) You assert you have a global government
8) You assert these government oficials are democratically elected
9) Democratic Global elections and global governance would be impossible without a vast communications infrastructure
10) Therefore, your government is impossible.
1) You assert there was no Catholic Church, which you have determined was the conversion of Constantine to Christianity on his deathbed
2) Christians continue to be persecruted, until they are extinct without the support of Roman.
3) Next would fall judaism and Islam without the strong wall the Catholics provided between the German invaders and the Palestinians.
4) Ultimately without Catholic defense The Norwegians would have conquered England, and been able to spread to mainland europe
5) The remaining religions are Norse, Hindu, various German tribal religions, and Eastern Mythos.
6) The Norse and Germans would clash
7) The germans would be able to hold back due to there home feild advantage
8) Eastern Invaders like Genghis Khan would easily crush the germans
9)The main super powers of the world would now be The Mongols, India and the Norse.
10) Norse and chinese would clash, Mongols would win and ultimately destroy the Norse.
11) India falls
12) Africa is not advanced enough to defend against the mongols, and is conquered.
13) The entire old world is controlled by the war hungry mongols.
14) You assert that this Somehow transforms into a utpoian society.
15) I assert you're a person from this universe who didnt quite remember the Mongols when you decided that it'd be a good idea to remove the Catholic church from history.
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Do you have solar powered factories that make more solar panels that run completely automatically while you all read and take strolls in the countryside?
There has to have been some kind of progress from laterns to solar power, and because you've described your society as uncurious and utopian, there is no motivation to get anything done, so i dont undestand how that much advancement came about.
What I meant by aliens are things from other planets, if that clarifies things.
We've been hearing so much about your religion, but you really havent told us much about it except that it acts nothing at all like a religion. Could you please give more detail on it?
And finally, is there atheism in your society and if so, is it tollerated?Â
No, I don't mean how your solar panels work, I mean how are they manufactured at all.Â
Do you have solar powered factories that make more solar panels that run completely automatically while you all read and take strolls in the countryside?
There has to have been some kind of progress from laterns to solar power, and because you've described your society as uncurious and utopian, there is no motivation to get anything done, so i dont undestand how that much advancement came about.
What I meant by aliens are things from other planets, if that clarifies things.
We've been hearing so much about your religion, but you really havent told us much about it except that it acts nothing at all like a religion. Could you please give more detail on it?
And finally, is there atheism in your society and if so, is it tollerated?Â
Darby
Epochal Historian
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
All of which begs the obvious question: If you have no idea at all about how the gadget works and your mission is spiritual rather than time travel (time travel serving only as an incidental mode of transportation) how the hell did you conclude that this time travel forum is the appropriate place to land rather than a religion, philosophy or political science based forum? You might have noticed as you read the posts that we're here to talk about time travel, the one topic of which you know nothing. Doh! (You did receive a mission brief, yes? Were you confused about the mission goal?)
And I was wondering, BTW. If your mission is to "spread spiritual knowledge that we hope will guide this Earth from a technological point of no return to a more naturalistic, spiritual way of being" and you're the first time traveler from your world: how the frack did your handlers know that we were in need of some hippie-dippie pyramid and crystals 1968 Haight-Ashbury paternal guidance or that your way was more "natural" than what was occuring on another planet in an entirely different universe that they had no previous contact with thus had no way of even knowing that it existed let alone what was occuring there? Were they loaded while designing the mission profile or just RF'ing the rookie chrononaut?
(And God how I wish the OWETO's would at least attempt to posit something unique ( this one isn't), interesting (definitely not in this case) and do some self pre-release editing to make sure that there is some form of self-consistency and logic in the details of their not-so-original sagas. It's not really that much to ask of them, Lord, is it? Or is it your Plan for them to implode after four days, spend two days attempting to recover and rest on the seventh and final day before disappearing into Lame TT History?)
All of which begs the obvious question: If you have no idea at all about how the gadget works and your mission is spiritual rather than time travel (time travel serving only as an incidental mode of transportation) how the hell did you conclude that this time travel forum is the appropriate place to land rather than a religion, philosophy or political science based forum? You might have noticed as you read the posts that we're here to talk about time travel, the one topic of which you know nothing. Doh! (You did receive a mission brief, yes? Were you confused about the mission goal?)
And I was wondering, BTW. If your mission is to "spread spiritual knowledge that we hope will guide this Earth from a technological point of no return to a more naturalistic, spiritual way of being" and you're the first time traveler from your world: how the frack did your handlers know that we were in need of some hippie-dippie pyramid and crystals 1968 Haight-Ashbury paternal guidance or that your way was more "natural" than what was occuring on another planet in an entirely different universe that they had no previous contact with thus had no way of even knowing that it existed let alone what was occuring there? Were they loaded while designing the mission profile or just RF'ing the rookie chrononaut?
(And God how I wish the OWETO's would at least attempt to posit something unique ( this one isn't), interesting (definitely not in this case) and do some self pre-release editing to make sure that there is some form of self-consistency and logic in the details of their not-so-original sagas. It's not really that much to ask of them, Lord, is it? Or is it your Plan for them to implode after four days, spend two days attempting to recover and rest on the seventh and final day before disappearing into Lame TT History?)
churchhead
Temporal Novice
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churchhead
Temporal Novice
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churchhead
Temporal Novice
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churchhead
Temporal Novice
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ddsilver
Chrono Cadet
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
I don't know what happened to my previous post, if it was deleted, I don't know why...
I won't go into the whole song and dance again, but, in short...
Here's my whole problem with these "enlightened" societies, who's passionate about sewage treatment? Who had the calling to become a garbageman? Who was the five year old who had a dream to one day be a mortician?
I'm not saying people can't be happy at these jobs, but, if everybody does the work they're "called" to, nobody would be doing those things. In order for that type of society to exist, you're either going to have to have slaves or highly advanced robots. And, I'm inb4 robots, too, so don't claim you have them now.
-D. Dodge Silver
I don't know what happened to my previous post, if it was deleted, I don't know why...
I won't go into the whole song and dance again, but, in short...
Here's my whole problem with these "enlightened" societies, who's passionate about sewage treatment? Who had the calling to become a garbageman? Who was the five year old who had a dream to one day be a mortician?
I'm not saying people can't be happy at these jobs, but, if everybody does the work they're "called" to, nobody would be doing those things. In order for that type of society to exist, you're either going to have to have slaves or highly advanced robots. And, I'm inb4 robots, too, so don't claim you have them now.
-D. Dodge Silver
ddsilver
Chrono Cadet
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Ok, I have some "spiritual" questions, then:
1. Please chart the development of your particular brand of monotheism. Did it develop from pantheism, or has the idea of a single divine being always been the standard in your culture?
2. At any time, have any analogues to our major (or minor) Earth religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism and Buddhism being the "big 5" so to speak) been in operation in your world? If so, compare and contrast.
Ok, I have some "spiritual" questions, then:
1. Please chart the development of your particular brand of monotheism. Did it develop from pantheism, or has the idea of a single divine being always been the standard in your culture?
2. At any time, have any analogues to our major (or minor) Earth religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism and Buddhism being the "big 5" so to speak) been in operation in your world? If so, compare and contrast.
churchhead
Temporal Novice
Post deleted by churchhead
ddsilver
Chrono Cadet
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Given your society's lack of reliance on technology, there's a million logistical issues that would have to be dealt with on a consistent basis in order to have a sustainable community. In addition to trash and waste management:
1. Crops and livestock have to be cared for, harvested, and processed into food. Sure, some folks aspire to be farmers and ranchers, but making butter is pretty far from a glamour profession.
2. Your radios (which you mentioned) and other items have to be manufactured. Raw materials have to be acquired and processed. Mining and forging are tough jobs. At some point, they have to be assembled and packaged, not to mention retailed.
3. Solar technology is great, but even if you rely on it 100%, distribution systems have to be maintained. You need electricians. On that note, you need general contractors, builders, plumbers, HVAC dudes, etc. Since your society values community so strongly, you must have building codes of a sort... that requires inspectors and engineers to develop the codes, and a government to put force of law behind the codes.
4. Have you ever noticed that scientific progress always leaps when new forms of communication are made available? Science and technology are pushed further when one person builds on the work of another who previously built on the work of other predecessors. The more ways to share information, the faster your science progresses. What are your means of mass communication? Who maintains them?
Given your society's lack of reliance on technology, there's a million logistical issues that would have to be dealt with on a consistent basis in order to have a sustainable community. In addition to trash and waste management:
1. Crops and livestock have to be cared for, harvested, and processed into food. Sure, some folks aspire to be farmers and ranchers, but making butter is pretty far from a glamour profession.
2. Your radios (which you mentioned) and other items have to be manufactured. Raw materials have to be acquired and processed. Mining and forging are tough jobs. At some point, they have to be assembled and packaged, not to mention retailed.
3. Solar technology is great, but even if you rely on it 100%, distribution systems have to be maintained. You need electricians. On that note, you need general contractors, builders, plumbers, HVAC dudes, etc. Since your society values community so strongly, you must have building codes of a sort... that requires inspectors and engineers to develop the codes, and a government to put force of law behind the codes.
4. Have you ever noticed that scientific progress always leaps when new forms of communication are made available? Science and technology are pushed further when one person builds on the work of another who previously built on the work of other predecessors. The more ways to share information, the faster your science progresses. What are your means of mass communication? Who maintains them?
ddsilver
Chrono Cadet
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Oh snap! I forgot one more question:
5. If you are here for the rest of your natural life, how did you prepare for that change? Do you have documentation (social security number, birth certificate, citizenship-type stuff)? Did you get a job, how are you supporting yourself? Are you aware that most countries have pretty serious penalties for illegal entry?
Oh snap! I forgot one more question:
5. If you are here for the rest of your natural life, how did you prepare for that change? Do you have documentation (social security number, birth certificate, citizenship-type stuff)? Did you get a job, how are you supporting yourself? Are you aware that most countries have pretty serious penalties for illegal entry?
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
Well, even if you're a hoaxer, I still admire your apparent spirituality. I am on a spiritual path of my own and I'm very happy with it. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
However, I'm not sure that attempting to persuade people to spiritually awaken would work with most of them. I tend to be of the belief that a person comes to religion or spirituality when they're ready for it, and of their own accord. It doesn't work for everyone. Not that there's anything wrong with some light encouragement, but it's best not to lay it on too thick - I usually think it's best to let people discover religion or spirituality on their own, without attempting to force their hand in any way.
Well, even if you're a hoaxer, I still admire your apparent spirituality. I am on a spiritual path of my own and I'm very happy with it. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif
However, I'm not sure that attempting to persuade people to spiritually awaken would work with most of them. I tend to be of the belief that a person comes to religion or spirituality when they're ready for it, and of their own accord. It doesn't work for everyone. Not that there's anything wrong with some light encouragement, but it's best not to lay it on too thick - I usually think it's best to let people discover religion or spirituality on their own, without attempting to force their hand in any way.
Re: Greetings from a Parallel Earth
But, If you are the first traveler here, how could you have possibily of learned before hand?
Could you give us an example of your langauge then?
When and how did your Earth's equivalent of our Industrial Revolution happen, and what technology came from it.
I'm taking you up on that offer, could you give us this breif history of your world and how it differs from ours.
But, If you are the first traveler here, how could you have possibily of learned before hand?
Could you give us an example of your langauge then?
When and how did your Earth's equivalent of our Industrial Revolution happen, and what technology came from it.
Â
I'm taking you up on that offer, could you give us this breif history of your world and how it differs from ours.