Civilizational Collapse and Future Conflicts

[Woody]

Every civilization ends at some point, we all already know by just reading history. The Romans, Egyptians, Greeks, Mayans, Aztecs…and the myriad of others have all come and gone. Is the civilization we’re living in now any different?…we’d like to think so, we would like to think we are more “civilized” and would make the necessary changes to alter this “end time” Titor describes. Are we that much better than any of the civilizations the predates the world we now live in?…In my opinion the radical Muslims are the “people” that need watching because throughout their history they have NEVER been a good regional neighbor. As Titor says, Israel wins this huge war against the Iranians, is that the catalyst that starts this world to its end? The rest of the world has to stop being so PC when it comes to handling Muslims, in my opinion, and I know it will not be a popular one is that we will have to destroy them one day, totally and completely or the next generation of radicals will continue us down this path of our own destruction…we cannot, and must not allow that to happen…no matter the cost…

 

[Classicalfan626]

Every civilization ends at some point, we all already know by just reading history. The Romans, Egyptians, Greeks, Mayans, Aztecs…and the myriad of others have all come and gone. Is the civilization we’re living in now any different?

Well, I think American civilization would be much different if it weren't for races of malevolent ETs, particularly the Reptilians, corrupting it with their evil ideas. ET races, both good and bad, have been visiting Earth and living among us for millennia. Also, I believe that most Muslims aren't what they're portrayed as in the media. There are bad Muslims out there, just as there's evil with every religion on Earth. But there is a caveat here. I also think that 9/11 was an inside job, contrary to popular belief.

Are you at all familiar with Q? Anyway, I believe that that and numerous interpreters found on uncensored sites such as Rumble are way more accurate than any source in the mainstream media, especially prior to 2015 and the emergence of Donald Trump in the political world.

 

[Woody]

Well, I think American civilization would be much different if it weren't for races of malevolent ETs, particularly the Reptilians, corrupting it with their evil ideas. ET races, both good and bad, have been visiting Earth and living among us for millennia. Also, I believe that most Muslims aren't what they're portrayed as in the media. There are bad Muslims out there, just as there's evil with every religion on Earth. But there is a caveat here. I also think that 9/11 was an inside job, contrary to popular belief.

Are you at all familiar with Q? Anyway, I believe that that and numerous interpreters found on uncensored sites such as Rumble are way more accurate than any source in the mainstream media, especially prior to 2015 and the emergence of Donald Trump in the political world.

I totally believe Trump will be nothing but great for the US, people all forget how good he had things going just prior to that total lie I call covid.
When I speak of Muslims, I’m not speaking of the everyday Muslim, I’m talking about the radical versions, those who indescrimently start shooting people, 9/11, when they put that pilot in the cage and burned him alive, Justin Berg who they beheaded live on video. It’s those types that will cause to many problems to be worth trying to deal with them. I know it’s hsrsh but they have to be totally and completely wiped from the earth, the radical Muslim has been like that for centuries and if they’re ALL wiped out we have to deal with the next generation of radical Muslim, they’re the one group causing huge problems. I believe they WILL be that catalyst to the demise of far too many of what they call “infidels” and if you don’t submit to their way of living under their god Allah, they will simply kill you and anyone else who doesn’t submit, the radical Muslim has been this same way for many centuries. It’s either us or them, they seem to have no issue dying for their cause. I say let’s help them, we MIUST NOT and CANNOT allow them to carry out their actions…no matter the cost…

 

[Woody]

Yes I know about Q, the omnipotent being that bothers the hell out of Picard, as far as other religions having bad members, I don’t see it, I’ve never heard of Catholics, Mormons, Protestants, Christians carrying out terrorist attacks. I think you’re totally wrong about that, the radical Muslim is the serious problem before us…

 

[Jay Walker]

I don’t see it, I’ve never heard of Catholics, Mormons, Protestants, Christians carrying out terrorist attacks.

Yes, you have. You heard of a couple of high school students taunting their fellow students before brutally ripping their faces off with automatic fire. You heard of Columbine. You heard of Uvalde TX.
As a matter of fact, you have heard of about 2,000 mass shootings in the U.S since Columbine.
I would be willing to bet you heard of Operation shock and awe as well. The U.S carries out dozens of operations that from a middle eastern person would be terrorist attacks. To us, it was revenge, to the history books it will be called international law violations. More specifically, the one about collective punishment.
Compared to what we were doing before and after 9/11, That day in September for us, would be just another day for them. Instead of hijacked planes, they deal with gunships, drones, ground forces, artillery, etc...


All of that is just recent history.
I know you have heard of the trail of tears, or the Indian Removal Act. Genocide, Slavery, Endless lynchings of children, woman and elderly up until only a few decades ago.
Lets see..
My fingers are getting tired. Mass incarceration, mass impoverishment, brutal authoritarianist police that have, and still kill over the color of skin.

Have you not heard of any of this?

Let's go further back in time.
Have you heard of Jericho, Makkedah, Libnah, Lachish, Eglon, Hebron, Debir, Ai or Canaan?

Joshua and the Israelites charged to conquer, destroy, and kill everything and everyone, including the livestock in these cities under direct orders from God.

Still fuzzy?

How about the Spanish Inquisition, and so on and so on.

Now, back to today.

Continuing the tradition of complete disregard for human life, you believe that a man that is a self-proclaimed, and found liable (by a jury of peers) rapist for president.

I think God put you in my path Woody.

You can respond angry and unconvinced but think about what exactly your retort will consist of. Actual evidence that is easy argue, or will you say something that has no evidence, like trump was set up.

Before you respond, I just want you to know that not everyone that doesn't like Trump is a Dem. I won't go into it, but just wanted you to know.


However, I believe the topic of this thread was about the Titor Fax.

He said there is nothing. Which doesn't exist, because even nothing is something. In the never ending story, "The Nothing" is really something.

But he mentions that he will stay for a while to check a theory he had that the world-line goes bad around 2000. Then his last post cryptically mentions why no one seems curious why Y2K wasn't a disaster.

If I this were a screenplay, that would be the direction i would like to take it, myself.

Time Traveler saves the world, and no one noticed, and the most recognition he ever took was a cryptic message on a forum people think are full mental patients. It's isn't Age of Ultron, but I am loving this story. Anybody else feel that?

 

[JudasTitor]

Yes, you have. You heard of a couple of high school students taunting their fellow students before brutally ripping their faces off with automatic fire. You heard of Columbine. You heard of Uvalde TX.
As a matter of fact, you have heard of about 2,000 mass shootings in the U.S since Columbine.
I would be willing to bet you heard of Operation shock and awe as well. The U.S carries out dozens of operations that from a middle eastern person would be terrorist attacks. To us, it was revenge, to the history books it will be called international law violations. More specifically, the one about collective punishment.
Compared to what we were doing before and after 9/11, That day in September for us, would be just another day for them. Instead of hijacked planes, they deal with gunships, drones, ground forces, artillery, etc...


All of that is just recent history.
I know you have heard of the trail of tears, or the Indian Removal Act. Genocide, Slavery, Endless lynchings of children, woman and elderly up until only a few decades ago.
Lets see..
My fingers are getting tired. Mass incarceration, mass impoverishment, brutal authoritarianist police that have, and still kill over the color of skin.

Have you not heard of any of this?

Let's go further back in time.
Have you heard of Jericho, Makkedah, Libnah, Lachish, Eglon, Hebron, Debir, Ai or Canaan?

Joshua and the Israelites charged to conquer, destroy, and kill everything and everyone, including the livestock in these cities under direct orders from God.

Still fuzzy?

How about the Spanish Inquisition, and so on and so on.

Now, back to today.

Continuing the tradition of complete disregard for human life, you believe that a man that is a self-proclaimed, and found liable (by a jury of peers) rapist for president.

I think God put you in my path Woody.

You can respond angry and unconvinced but think about what exactly your retort will consist of. Actual evidence that is easy argue, or will you say something that has no evidence, like trump was set up.

Before you respond, I just want you to know that not everyone that doesn't like Trump is a Dem. I won't go into it, but just wanted you to know.


However, I believe the topic of this thread was about the Titor Fax.

He said there is nothing. Which doesn't exist, because even nothing is something. In the never ending story, "The Nothing" is really something.

But he mentions that he will stay for a while to check a theory he had that the world-line goes bad around 2000. Then his last post cryptically mentions why no one seems curious why Y2K wasn't a disaster.

If I this were a screenplay, that would be the direction i would like to take it, myself.

Time Traveler saves the world, and no one noticed, and the most recognition he ever took was a cryptic message on a forum people think are full mental patients. It's isn't Age of Ultron, but I am loving this story. Anybody else feel that?

I like to imagine that humanity has been saved on multiple occasions by some unnamed farmer that seeks no recognition afterwards, and quietly returns to his crops, livestock & wife, as if the rest of the planet and it's contents were but a mere extension of his acreage under stewardship.

 

[Jay Walker]

I like to imagine that humanity has been saved on multiple occasions by some unnamed farmer that seeks no recognition afterwards, and quietly returns to his crops, livestock & wife, as if the rest of the planet and it's contents were but a mere extension of his acreage under stewardship.

Beautifully said. I was expecting a "but..." or the classic "however..." Except you didn't. Implying finality in your statement. Personally, I like that ending too. Sunsetting on an unknown hero squinting somewhere off camera, as if to say, A hero's job is never done. But... What if H.G Wells was correct, and like Weena, we are bound to our destiny?

 

[Woody]

Yes, you have. You heard of a couple of high school students taunting their fellow students before brutally ripping their faces off with automatic fire. You heard of Columbine. You heard of Uvalde TX.
As a matter of fact, you have heard of about 2,000 mass shootings in the U.S since Columbine.
I would be willing to bet you heard of Operation shock and awe as well. The U.S carries out dozens of operations that from a middle eastern person would be terrorist attacks. To us, it was revenge, to the history books it will be called international law violations. More specifically, the one about collective punishment.
Compared to what we were doing before and after 9/11, That day in September for us, would be just another day for them. Instead of hijacked planes, they deal with gunships, drones, ground forces, artillery, etc...


All of that is just recent history.
I know you have heard of the trail of tears, or the Indian Removal Act. Genocide, Slavery, Endless lynchings of children, woman and elderly up until only a few decades ago.
Lets see..
My fingers are getting tired. Mass incarceration, mass impoverishment, brutal authoritarianist police that have, and still kill over the color of skin.

Have you not heard of any of this?

Let's go further back in time.
Have you heard of Jericho, Makkedah, Libnah, Lachish, Eglon, Hebron, Debir, Ai or Canaan?

Joshua and the Israelites charged to conquer, destroy, and kill everything and everyone, including the livestock in these cities under direct orders from God.

Still fuzzy?

How about the Spanish Inquisition, and so on and so on.

Now, back to today.

Continuing the tradition of complete disregard for human life, you believe that a man that is a self-proclaimed, and found liable (by a jury of peers) rapist for president.

I think God put you in my path Woody.

You can respond angry and unconvinced but think about what exactly your retort will consist of. Actual evidence that is easy argue, or will you say something that has no evidence, like trump was set up.

Before you respond, I just want you to know that not everyone that doesn't like Trump is a Dem. I won't go into it, but just wanted you to know.


However, I believe the topic of this thread was about the Titor Fax.

He said there is nothing. Which doesn't exist, because even nothing is something. In the never ending story, "The Nothing" is really something.

But he mentions that he will stay for a while to check a theory he had that the world-line goes bad around 2000. Then his last post cryptically mentions why no one seems curious why Y2K wasn't a disaster.

If I this were a screenplay, that would be the direction i would like to take it, myself.

Time Traveler saves the world, and no one noticed, and the most recognition he ever took was a cryptic message on a forum people think are full mental patients. It's isn't Age of Ultron, but I am loving this story. Anybody else feel that?

I think you’re going off on weird tangents using those school shootings as something like what is done by radicalized Muslims, those shootings were done internally within the US by US citizens and will not be perceived in the same way as those done by ISIS, HAMAS etc etc. I’m using those Muslim done terror attacks in the context of the world could possibly come to an end. I think you lost that along the way, Titor said that Israel defeated the Iranians in a war, that’s what could possibly be the catalyst that starts the world down that road to our destruction. Titor also said there is no Planet Earth history after 2534…is that the year he said?…in any case, The US is an idealist country, the Muslims throughout their long history haven’t gotten along with any of its regional neighbors, they’ve attacked them every time. They tolerate only one kind of people, only other Muslims and thats it. To me as I said have an opinion that will be very unpopular, we have to stop them by the most expedient means at our disposal and every last one of them will have to be destroyed or will have to deal with them generationally. It’s either us or them…if there is a better way to keep our planet from being destroyed, I’m all ears..

 

[Jay Walker]

I think you’re going off on weird tangents using those school shootings as something like what is done by radicalized Muslims, those shootings were done internally within the US by US citizens and will not be perceived in the same way as those done by ISIS, HAMAS etc etc. I’m using those Muslim done terror attacks in the context of the world could possibly come to an end. I think you lost that along the way, Titor said that Israel defeated the Iranians in a war, that’s what could possibly be the catalyst that starts the world down that road to our destruction. Titor also said there is no Planet Earth history after 2534…is that the year he said?…in any case, The US is an idealist country, the Muslims throughout their long history haven’t gotten along with any of its regional neighbors, they’ve attacked them every time. They tolerate only one kind of people, only other Muslims and thats it. To me as I said have an opinion that will be very unpopular, we have to stop them by the most expedient means at our disposal and every last one of them will have to be destroyed or will have to deal with them generationally. It’s either us or them…if there is a better way to keep our planet from being destroyed, I’m all ears..

I see what you mean, that is where I got confused. We interpreted the fax differently. What I thought Titor said, to me, sounded like when the frames of a movie end, and the light passes through blank frames, only without the light. In other words, some interpret the fax as the end of earth, but he didn't say the earth was gone, he said there was nothing but darkness all around. Another thing I found interesting, is that it sounds like he didn't personally see the end, but other temporal drivers have reported seeing the same thing, darkness. If it were only the earth, the sun and other celestial bodies would have been visible. But no light? Nothing? Even nothing is something, but the nothing he briefly described sounded like actual nothing. I think that is why I misunderstood the convo, the discussion was assuming the end of the world, or humanity. Which I agree, war will bring about our destruction. But how I interpret what Titior saying, not even humans will have that capability.


Sorry we got off on the wrong foot Woody.
-J.

 

[Woody]

Going by what Titor says that “Israel defeated Iran in a big war”….that I don’t know if I can go along with that. Israel is 2nd only to the U.S. in combat ability, Israelis pilots would make short work of Iranian pilots, Israel would lay waste to any Iranian combat power in a a couple of weeks if not days. I’ve long been an amateur scholar of past and recent military history for the last 40 years. Israelis pilots train here in the US not far from where I live. If the “gloves are off” Israel will devastate Iran, and that’s in a conventional weapons war. The Iranian dead would be horrendous in the extreme, Israel has most of the US’s best equipment along with the very well engineered and weaponry of their own. With that said, I’m not sure how this Israel/Iran war of the future can be this catalyst of our destruction, unless the rest of the world’s Muslims take exception to Jews (who are centuries long enemies) destroying a country inhabited by 90% Muslims. Possibly other Muslim countries will come to the aid of Iran and if that happens I’m sure the US will have to become involved. I don’t worry about China like most people do, although they do have long range missiles but most of their combat power is landlocked, any ship leaving its ports will be sunk by the US’s submarine force before it gets a mile out. If you look at a map of the US’s base locations around the world, you’ll see that China is surrounded, They woukd neet their destruction from all directions and if the US ever launched an all out combined arms attack. the devastation would be biblical. So back to what we’re supposed to be talking about, we could play out all these fanciful scenarios, but the earth’s destruction seemingly would come from the other Muslim countries coming to Iran’s aid, even tho countries like Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan but even with the addition of those countries Israel would have little trouble with them either. Israel fought against 3 countries before and prevailed. I guess I’m going to have to read into Titor’s messages again to see if I can understand better hiw he feels a Middle East war takes us down a path to our destruction

 

[Woody]

This all hinges on if this John Titor is legit or just some guy pretending to be this “time traveler” ….theres no way to be sure, unless he shows himself to some person, but if he truly is a time traveler, he cannot expose himself because he might irreparably damage our time line…

 

[Jay Walker]

This all hinges on if this John Titor is legit or just some guy pretending to be this “time traveler” ….theres no way to be sure, unless he shows himself to some person, but if he truly is a time traveler, he cannot expose himself because he might irreparably damage our time line…

Exposing himself on any world-line is a felony.
Still, according to Titor, a minor divergence occurs while traveling backwards, but he said the longer he there, the divergence becomes further away from his world-line's history. As he sits at a computer posting on this forum the divergence gets larger as time flows here. He ended the sentence explaining the concept (which is key) he said the divergence gets larger (from his perspective). Meaning that anything that he may have changed would only cause more of a divergence that will continue diverging even after he leaves to return to his world-line.

For example, if he stops Y2K, the second U.S. civil war never happens. Then, WW3 never happens, making our 2024 very different from his 2024.

So, I guess what I am saying, is that it doesn't matter if he really was a time traveler. To me, his message was clear. We are over privileged and power hungry. We are a wasteful species that never actually gives back what we take from the planet. The only species in existence that we are aware of that does that. Even when we pass legislation to reduce carbon admissions, (which is like pulling teeth from an alligator) it doesn't give back to the planet, it only reduces the rate in which we take.

If anything reduces our species to extinction, it will be that reason.

 

[Woody]

Exposing himself on any world-line is a felony.
Still, according to Titor, a minor divergence occurs while traveling backwards, but he said the longer he there, the divergence becomes further away from his world-line's history. As he sits at a computer posting on this forum the divergence gets larger as time flows here. He ended the sentence explaining the concept (which is key) he said the divergence gets larger (from his perspective). Meaning that anything that he may have changed would only cause more of a divergence that will continue diverging even after he leaves to return to his world-line.

For example, if he stops Y2K, the second U.S. civil war never happens. Then, WW3 never happens, making our 2024 very different from his 2024.

So, I guess what I am saying, is that it doesn't matter if he really was a time traveler. To me, his message was clear. We are over privileged and power hungry. We are a wasteful species that never actually gives back what we take from the planet. The only species in existence that we are aware of that does that. Even when we pass legislation to reduce carbon admissions, (which is like pulling teeth from an alligator) it doesn't give back to the planet, it only reduces the rate in which we take.

If anything reduces our species to extinction, it will be that reason.

I don’t believe a guy who travels time woukd worry about wether what he does or doesn’t do is a felonious. I would hope any actions he takes will have the US’s best interest at heart.
My worry, which may or may not be unfounded is what Titor says about this Israel/Iran war, which I believe if that occurs, Israel will have little trouble in defeating Iran, the fact that Muslims hate Jews, and when Israel defeats Iran, other Muslim countries, even tho they may care much for them it’s the idea that Jews were fighting against Muslims, will come to their aid. That scenario is and most likely in my opinion is that catalyst that sends us down that road to world destruction. Titor doesn’t give a date for that Middle Eastern war, but he also says he sees no earth history past 2534…that’s quite far in our history, we both will be long gone before any of this, if it even does, plays out…

 

[Jay Walker]

I don’t believe a guy who travels time woukd worry about wether what he does or doesn’t do is a felonious. I would hope any actions he takes will have the US’s best interest at heart.
My worry, which may or may not be unfounded is what Titor says about this Israel/Iran war, which I believe if that occurs, Israel will have little trouble in defeating Iran, the fact that Muslims hate Jews, and when Israel defeats Iran, other Muslim countries, even tho they may care much for them it’s the idea that Jews were fighting against Muslims, will come to their aid. That scenario is and most likely in my opinion is that catalyst that sends us down that road to world destruction. Titor doesn’t give a date for that Middle Eastern war, but he also says he sees no earth history past 2534…that’s quite far in our history, we both will be long gone before any of this, if it even does, plays out…

I can see you kind of got tunnel vision. I have it too but focused on other things.

So, the thing about Isreal and Palestine for me, and I am no expert, but for me, this goes back to the Old Testament.

Joshua and the Israelites.

Joshua Claimed that God charged him with conquering Canaan. Canaan was the promised land. There were rules established during that time, for instance, women of conquered cities were considered plunder. "Deuteronomy 20:14 As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the Lord your God gives you from your enemies."
Another rule said that before attacking cities were to be visited and given a choice. If you wish to be peaceful, we will enslave you, if wish to not be peaceful, we will kill you all. Including the livestock.
Deuteronomy 20: 12,16,17:
12 If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city.
16 However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
17 Completely destroy them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you.


Today, Jews in Isreal (as they always have) follow the Old Testament. Does any of that biblical text sound familiar?


Personally, (not trying to convince you, just telling you my observations and studies)

I think that they are both crazy.

Not resorting to name-calling (reason being)

In the very next chapter...

Deuteronomy 20:18
Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the Lord your God

Muslims and Jews are both Abrahamic Religions. They worship the same God!!

Supporting one faction over another is (to me) an exercise in futility.

 

[Woody]

I can see you kind of got tunnel vision. I have it too but focused on other things.

So, the thing about Isreal and Palestine for me, and I am no expert, but for me, this goes back to the Old Testament.

Joshua and the Israelites.

Joshua Claimed that God charged him with conquering Canaan. Canaan was the promised land. There were rules established during that time, for instance, women of conquered cities were considered plunder. "Deuteronomy 20:14 As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the Lord your God gives you from your enemies."
Another rule said that before attacking cities were to be visited and given a choice. If you wish to be peaceful, we will enslave you, if wish to not be peaceful, we will kill you all. Including the livestock.
Deuteronomy 20: 12,16,17:
12 If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city.
16 However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
17 Completely destroy them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you.


Today, Jews in Isreal (as they always have) follow the Old Testament. Does any of that biblical text sound familiar?


Personally, (not trying to convince you, just telling you my observations and studies)

I think that they are both crazy.

Not resorting to name-calling (reason being)

In the very next chapter...

Deuteronomy 20:18
Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the Lord your God

Muslims and Jews are both Abrahamic Religions. They worship the same God!!

Supporting one faction over another is (to me) an exercise in futility.

Doesn’t matter if Muslims and Jews worship the same god, they have not liked each other since time began. Muslims have never been good regional neighbors, down thru their history they have attacked each and every non Islamic country. I’m not a believer in religions, I truly think it was thought up by some pretty wise people for nothing more to control the masses as best they could. I’d bet everything I own thst in the Vatican archives is evidence that says just that, wow would I love to poke around in the archives of the Vatican. It holds secrets of some of mankind’s greatest secrets like how much of a farce all religions are. Those people who thought up the religions didn’t think they’d lead to so many ideaology wars down thru the centuries. I still firmly believe that if that war that Titor says happens between Israel and Iran, and that other Muslim nations will come to Iran’s aid, (after Israel lays waste to Iran, that will mean biblical levels of causalities for Iran even if Israel keeps it a conventional war, means the US would become involved)…that will lead us to the destruction sometime in 2534

 

[Jay Walker]

Doesn’t matter if Muslims and Jews worship the same god, they have not liked each other since time began. Muslims have never been good regional neighbors, down thru their history they have attacked each and every non Islamic country. I’m not a believer in religions, I truly think it was thought up by some pretty wise people for nothing more to control the masses as best they could. I’d bet everything I own thst in the Vatican archives is evidence that says just that, wow would I love to poke around in the archives of the Vatican. It holds secrets of some of mankind’s greatest secrets like how much of a farce all religions are. Those people who thought up the religions didn’t think they’d lead to so many ideaology wars down thru the centuries. I still firmly believe that if that war that Titor says happens between Israel and Iran, and that other Muslim nations will come to Iran’s aid, (after Israel lays waste to Iran, that will mean biblical levels of causalities for Iran even if Israel keeps it a conventional war, means the US would become involved)…that will lead us to the destruction sometime in 2534

I'm with you. I have been studying Christianity for the last year or so. It has been a wild and ridiculous ride. The Old Testament has some gnarly stuff going on.

As for the war between Isreal and Iran. Do you remember when Russia was in Afghanistan in the 80's. They made a movie called Charlie Wilson's War. The Russian Gunships were tearing them a new butthole every day. Our gunners have standards and moral souls for the most part, but those Russian Gunships were wreaking havoc. Until, our CIA slipped the Taliban some stinger ground to air heat seekers. It wasn't long before they figured out how to use them, and those gunships were like swatting flies. Russia quickly pulled out.
My point is, that 3rd world countries typically have one way of defending themselves historically. That is hiding in plain sight and ambushing the occupying forces, unless the opposition just bombs the crap out of them. That is because those people can't fight a modern military head-to-head.
These kinds of occupations will go on forever but will not lead to mass destruction. Iran may be semi-modern, but they don't stand a chance even with every middle eastern country coming to their aide. But that is unlikely, because that has never happened before, due to in-fighting and internal conflicts.

The conflict that is worrisome for me, is the Ukraine war. That is two relatively modern militaries going to head-to-head. Depending how Trump handles that situation will determine if Putin begins using tactical nukes to wipeout Ukraine cities.

Our future also hangs in the balance depending on Trump deciding to back out of NATO and pissing off those nuclear armed countries that have been developing their own modern arsenals.


Law Makers consider war based on potential outcomes in the macro sense of how it will end, and how it will be won. But, if you and I happen to be one of the many sent to the front lines, how the war ends will matter little. Because chances are, you and I will be dead by then.

 

[Tysarau]

I'm with you. I have been studying Christianity for the last year or so. It has been a wild and ridiculous ride. The Old Testament has some gnarly stuff going on.

As for the war between Isreal and Iran. Do you remember when Russia was in Afghanistan in the 80's. They made a movie called Charlie Wilson's War. The Russian Gunships were tearing them a new butthole every day. Our gunners have standards and moral souls for the most part, but those Russian Gunships were wreaking havoc. Until, our CIA slipped the Taliban some stinger ground to air heat seekers. It wasn't long before they figured out how to use them, and those gunships were like swatting flies. Russia quickly pulled out.
My point is, that 3rd world countries typically have one way of defending themselves historically. That is hiding in plain sight and ambushing the occupying forces, unless the opposition just bombs the crap out of them. That is because those people can't fight a modern military head-to-head.
These kinds of occupations will go on forever but will not lead to mass destruction. Iran may be semi-modern, but they don't stand a chance even with every middle eastern country coming to their aide. But that is unlikely, because that has never happened before, due to in-fighting and internal conflicts.

The conflict that is worrisome for me, is the Ukraine war. That is two relatively modern militaries going to head-to-head. Depending how Trump handles that situation will determine if Putin begins using tactical nukes to wipeout Ukraine cities.

Our future also hangs in the balance depending on Trump deciding to back out of NATO and pissing off those nuclear armed countries that have been developing their own modern arsenals.


Law Makers consider war based on potential outcomes in the macro sense of how it will end, and how it will be won. But, if you and I happen to be one of the many sent to the front lines, how the war ends will matter little. Because chances are, you and I will be dead by then.

I wouldn't say that Ukraine and Russia have more or less the same armies, and it's not even because of the amount of combat power. At the very least, almost all of Ukraine's equipment is supplied by someone, unlike Russia.
And also, I wonder why you portrayed the Russians as such beasts in Afghanistan, but at the same time forgot what terrible weapons you used in Vietnam? Napalm, and the "Agent *color*" series of weapons created on its basis. I apologize in advance, I don't want any political quarrels, I just got a little upset.

 

[Jay Walker]

I wouldn't say that Ukraine and Russia have more or less the same armies, and it's not even because of the amount of combat power. At the very least, almost all of Ukraine's equipment is supplied by someone, unlike Russia.
And also, I wonder why you portrayed the Russians as such beasts in Afghanistan, but at the same time forgot what terrible weapons you used in Vietnam. Napalm, and the "Agent *color*" series of weapons created on its basis. I apologize in advance, I don't want any political quarrels, I just got a little upset.

Hi. I see what you mean. I apologize
No, there is no political quarrel. "Agent *color*" is still causing birth defects and endless other problems to this day. I didn't mean to downplay the U. S's atrocities around the world. Actually, if you read a little further back, that's what got me into this convo.

For the most part, Warren and I were disagreeing with how the world would end. It turned into a disagreement about religion. yada, yada, yada.

I also agree that Ukraine and Russia are not the same militarily. However, the weapons being supplied to Ukraine are from NATO countries that are more or less testing the combat effectiveness of their tech in real-world scenarios. That kind of information is hard to come by typically without putting your own troops into harm's way.

As far as the Russian Gunships in Afghanistan, It was the accounts from the Taliban themselves that were describing the ruthlessness. It is public record justifying the U.S intervention in that conflict. It sounds like to me there were much fewer orders through the chain of command to open fire from the Russian Helos at the time.

Again, I meant no dismissal of involvement, or offense.

 

[Tysarau]

Hi. I see what you mean. I apologize
No, there is no political quarrel. "Agent *color*" is still causing birth defects and endless other problems to this day. I didn't mean to downplay the U. S's atrocities around the world. Actually, if you read a little further back, that's what got me into this convo.

For the most part, Warren and I were disagreeing with how the world would end. It turned into a disagreement about religion. yada, yada, yada.

I also agree that Ukraine and Russia are not the same militarily. However, the weapons being supplied to Ukraine are from NATO countries that are more or less testing the combat effectiveness of their tech in real-world scenarios. That kind of information is hard to come by typically without putting your own troops into harm's way.

As far as the Russian Gunships in Afghanistan, It was the accounts from the Taliban themselves that were describing the ruthlessness. It is public record justifying the U.S intervention in that conflict. It sounds like to me there were much fewer orders through the chain of command to open fire from the Russian Helos at the time.

Again, I meant no dismissal of involvement, or offense.

Glad we understood each other. I admit, my mistake, I did not notice the specific thread that led you to this conversation and did not know about the recording of the errors themselves. Glad we understood each other.

 

[Jay Walker]

Glad we understood each other. I admit, my mistake, I did not notice the specific thread that led you to this conversation and did not know about the recording of the errors themselves. Glad we understood each other.

Nice to meet you. What brings you here? Anything specific or general interest?
Personally, I have always been interested since I was around 12 or 13. I was walking along, thinking to myself "if time travel was possible, travelers would be everywhere. If that is the case, they should only observe and never interact with the past."
I don't even know why I thought that. But I remember the moment.