Division of the United States into 5 regions?

[servantx]

What are these White House petitions in the United States? Are they serious?

Peacefully grant the State of Texas to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government. | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

Peacefully grant the State of Louisiana to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government. | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

Peacefully grant the State of Florida to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government. | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

Peacefully grant the State of Georgia to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government. | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

Peacefully grant the State of North Carolina to withdraw from the United States and create its own NEW government | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

 

[Dexter]

No state can legally withdraw from the Union unless congress was foolish enough to pass amendments supporting that, which I believe not even they are dull enough to do. Despite the popular belief, Texas isn't allowed to withdraw from the U.S. without senate approval.
Texas can however, divide itself into smaller areas, or different states, to give itself more control int the House of representatives; which would allow them to pass laws much easier, in which case they could even allow itself to form it's own nation, independent of the United States.
But to answer your question, Yes. I do believe that States should be allowed to withdraw, especially seeing the direction the U.S. is going economically, especially with the 72 month unemployment benefits, and gradually growing socialist ideals. These new regions could be an example for the rest of the nation on how to create a stable economy.

 

[Temporal Recon]

No state can legally withdraw from the Union unless congress was foolish enough to pass amendments supporting that, which I believe not even they are dull enough to do. Despite the popular belief, Texas isn't allowed to withdraw from the U.S. without senate approval.

Was the Revolutionary War legal? Was the First American Civil War legal? Was the French Revolution legal?

Insurrection is never legal. But it is sometimes necessary.

Are we to forgo liberty because defending it has been outlawed?

 

[Dexter]

Was the First American Civil War legal? //Implying that there was indeed a second, or third, or any thereafter.

Insurrection is never legal. //The topic was to peacefully grant the separation.

Like you said, how insurrection is sometimes necessary, I do agree. Some conflicts cannot be handled by peaceful means.

 

[Darby]

No state can legally withdraw from the Union unless congress was foolish enough to pass amendments supporting that

Congress cannot pass amendments to the Constitution. Congress, by a 2/3rds majority vote in both the House and Senate, can propose amendments. Thereafter it takes a vote of 3/4ths of the state legislatures to ratify the proposed amendment. Alternatively, 2/3rds of the states can call for a Constitutional Convention to pass amendments. Amendments proposed by the Convention require 3/4ths of the state legislatures for ratification. The Convention form has only been used once, in 1787 (and it threw out the Articles of Confederation in its entirety).

See Article V, US Constitution "Amendment."

The Constitution is mute as to the power of a State to withdraw from the Union. The 10th mendments states:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

If the Constitution does not prohibit a State from withdrawing then is can be strongly argued that the State can withdraw. It will, of course, cause a war just as it did the last time.

The crux of the above states' argument is the ongoing violations by the entire Federal government of the Supremacy Clause in Article VI, Article III, Sec. 1 (Judicial Powers as it applies to "interpreting the Constitution"), the States Rights clause of the 10th Amendment, Article V (Amendment) in its entirety and the the Republican Form of government guarantee to the States in Article IV, Sec. 4.

Contrary to what your teacher(s) may have told you, the Constitution is not a "living, breathing document" subject to self-amendment based on a whim, popular opinion, the opinion of the US Supreme Court or changes of date. The bottom line of the "living and breathing document" philosophy is that you your rights are defined by popular opinion, meaning you have no guaranteed rights. It also means that your rights spring from the consent of the Federal government. The Federal government did not grant you those rights. The People and the Several States created the Constitution from which the Federal government is created, not the other way around. The States were originally 13 individual nations which banded together to form a single country.

 

[John Thomas]

Was the Revolutionary War legal? Was the First American Civil War legal? Was the French Revolution legal?

Insurrection is never legal. But it is sometimes necessary.

Are we to forgo liberty because defending it has been outlawed?

Times have changed, Temporal Recon. How do feel about the possibility of there being no U.S. Civil War 2 at all? You give the people enough Marijuana, enough free media and welfare and they'll stay inside. Also, the minimum wage is going up. People are starting to listen. I'm optimistic. It is better if the U.S. stays together. I've reviewed all the outcomes.

 

[Transient001]

Hello Friends of EarthTR125.0121

As it is the US will remain together for a very long time, people had always dreamt up of separating from the Union but that is an outcome that will only come to be after great struggles and even then it will not matter. The states-countries will be so dilapidated that it will serve no one to be non-annexed.

 

[Temporal Recon]

Times have changed, Temporal Recon. How do feel about the possibility of there being no U.S. Civil War 2 at all? You give the people enough Marijuana, enough free media and welfare and they'll stay inside. Also, the minimum wage is going up. People are starting to listen. I'm optimistic. It is better if the U.S. stays together. I've reviewed all the outcomes.

I made no statements on liklihood or outcome, John Thomas.

 

[Darby]

Times have changed, Temporal Recon. How do feel about the possibility of there being no U.S. Civil War 2 at all? You give the people enough Marijuana, enough free media and welfare and they'll stay inside. Also, the minimum wage is going up. People are starting to listen. I'm optimistic. It is better if the U.S. stays together. I've reviewed all the outcomes.

Thomas,

That's a half-assed answer to his question. His question was, "Was the Revolutionary War legal?" Answer his question, please.

 

[John Thomas]

I made no statements on liklihood or outcome, John Thomas.

Glad to hear it.

 

[John Thomas]

Thomas,

That's a half-assed answer to his question. His question was, "Was the Revolutionary War legal?" Answer his question, please.

Since the government determines what is legal, revolution against the government is illegal.

 

[Transient001]

I like your signature Dexter, most fitting to the topic.

 

[Dexter]

You give the people enough Marijuana, enough free media and welfare and they'll stay inside. Also, the minimum wage is going up. People are starting to listen. I'm optimistic. It is better if the U.S. stays together. I've reviewed all the outcomes.

51% of Americans pay no Federal Income tax. Welfare is not free, 49% of America is paying for 51%, and themselves. Sure the 51% not paying Federal Taxes are glad, but what about the 49% paying half or more of their gross income? Surely that demographic must be quite upset, and soon file for tax-cuts, as did the 49%. Soon enough, with enough not paying federal taxes, how does the government make money to pay for it's welfare programs?

Borrow money from China? America is already Trillions of U.S. dollars in debt, that deficit will come around to bite in the arse. The fact of the matter is that the country as a whole does not have enough funds to continue on the path that it is traveling.

Minimum wage going up is often misinterpreted, as it is due to inflation and a wage/price spiral.

But I do agree with you somewhat, times have changed.

 

[Darby]

America is already Trillions of U.S. dollars in debt, that deficit will come around to bite in the arse.

And that debt is far more dangerous than it appears to the naked eye. Yes, China is holding several trillion dollars in notes, bonds and other debt instruments issued against their loans to the US. The problem is that they cannot use those instruments internally. China's internal economy does not trade in US Dollars. They can use the paper to trade for oil and other imports. But they have expanded their internal economy far, far too quickly, especially in a bad world economy. They don't need any imports because imports compete with their internals. They need less oil right now because of the reduced demand. They are stuck holding paper, payable in US Dollars. A default by the US on loan payments could well lead to WWIII.

 

[Dexter]

China's internal economy does not trade in US Dollars.

Yes, I was relating the amount owed to the worth in dollars.

The fact that bothers me the most however, is that even though the U.S. government owes various nations large sums of goods, like China, the government continually aids these nations financially, and gives over 100 million worth in U.S. currency for environmental purposes purely. Soon enough, the citizens are going to be upset enough to take action.