Darby, have a diagram about Higgs Boson
- Thread starter servantx
- Start date
Transient001
Quantum Scribe
Hello
The question wasnt directed to me but I dare say its not. The Higgs Mechanism is a rather more complex system. Thye Higgs Mechanism is the way in which all particles acquiere mass in space and are capable to exist within the multilayered hyperdimensional fields of each universe. They acquiere mass by being excited into a particular critical event which can be found everywhere in space, but not the same way around. The diagram above seems rather crude and simple. But then again it could be the simplifications of an ingenious mind.
The question wasnt directed to me but I dare say its not. The Higgs Mechanism is a rather more complex system. Thye Higgs Mechanism is the way in which all particles acquiere mass in space and are capable to exist within the multilayered hyperdimensional fields of each universe. They acquiere mass by being excited into a particular critical event which can be found everywhere in space, but not the same way around. The diagram above seems rather crude and simple. But then again it could be the simplifications of an ingenious mind.
Darby
Epochal Historian
Hi Darby,
I found this diagram/equation on the net, someone claimed that this is the Higgs Boson mechanism.
Do you understand it? If yes, please explain.
Thanks
Not a clue. The equation is gibberish. Pi (3.14) and Phi (1.618) are defined terms if we accept the standard values that they are assigned in mathematics. All it says is:
6.28 + (5.0832)^3 ~= 1/alpha...but it doesn't define alpha.
The diagram apparently shows a particle running in a circle through three surfaces H, omega, aleph and back through H. The spin of the particle is noted and labeled 2 pi. 2 Pi radians is 360 degrees - a complete circle. The values assigned to the 2d surfaces is Pi Phi. Undefined as to why.
I think that if the Higgs Boson mechanism could be explained by high school pre-algebra using two standard terms it wouldn't be a mystery that takes the LHC to explore.
Where's the article that this came from?
John Thomas
Temporal Navigator
Darby and Trans, this diagram and equation is an attempt to apply a golden ratio spin to sub-particle physics. The guy is trying to say that a field created by a Kerr black hole is shaped like a sea-shell. At least, that is how I interpret this.
A Higgs Bosson is a particle/wave/force that pushes on heavier elements more and lighter particles such as electrons and positrons less. Or maybe my description and understanding of it is wrong.
A Higgs Bosson is a particle/wave/force that pushes on heavier elements more and lighter particles such as electrons and positrons less. Or maybe my description and understanding of it is wrong.
servantx
Quantum Scribe
John, do you mean seashell like this?
Golden ratio discovered in quantum world: Hidden symmetry observed for the first time in solid state matter
John Thomas
Temporal Navigator
John, do you mean seashell like this?
Golden ratio discovered in quantum world: Hidden symmetry observed for the first time in solid state matter
Yes I do. And please note Transient001's avatar. His clock is also spiraling just like that.
John Thomas
Temporal Navigator
Hello
The question wasnt directed to me but I dare say its not. The Higgs Mechanism is a rather more complex system. Thye Higgs Mechanism is the way in which all particles acquiere mass in space and are capable to exist within the multilayered hyperdimensional fields of each universe. They acquiere mass by being excited into a particular critical event which can be found everywhere in space, but not the same way around. The diagram above seems rather crude and simple. But then again it could be the simplifications of an ingenious mind.
People in 2012 are fond of charts. They don't like to draw the actual geometry of the model. Look at the current standard model.
John Thomas
Temporal Navigator
The first dimension is a line.
The second dimension is like a comic book.
The 3rd dimension is like a 3d image.
The 4th dimension is video and the progression of time.
The 5th dimension is reflected and recorded memory, a spirit world, if you will.
The golden ratio spirals infinitely in both the inward direction and outward direction.
This number is infinite. There aren't just 5 dimensions.
..as far as we are concerned only 5 dimensions are needed in order for us to master space, time and gravity.
Darby
Epochal Historian
There's nothing there to understand. It's a graphic with a simplistic equation and no explanation - even the terms are undefined. And where in that graphic do you see anything suggesting a Kerr black hole? I see no angular momentum, charge or mass indicated anywhere. Spin is not rotation. Spin is a quantum state of a particle that has no classical equivalent.
Servantx,
Where is the link to the source of the graphic?
servantx
Quantum Scribe
Hi Darby,
Geometric Interpretation of Fine Structure
And Higgs Boson is a fine-structure constant.
The Phi Φ in the graphic has something to do with the golden spiral.
They said this Golden Ratio Φ has something to do with quantum mechanics.
Golden ratio discovered in quantum world: Hidden symmetry observed for the first time in solid state matter
Transient001
Quantum Scribe
Servant this is closer to the metric of a Kerr Black Hole:
This metric is equivalent to a co-rotating reference frame that is rotating with angular speed Ω that depends on both the radius r and the colatitudeθ, where Ω is called the Annihilation Event.
You can also munch on this investigation as well:
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0808/0808.2977v2.pdf
Thomas I beg to differ on your proposal of dimensional causation. First we might define what a dimension is. Is it a place? Awareness?Consciousness? or part of a Geometric Form?
I tend to believe that a dimension holds a seemingly infinite array of patters but is thoroughly finite and bound by yet an even greater degree of dimension. The first dimension would be Zero Space where everything is compressed and nothing is defined.
Then the 1st dimension is a point. Note that the inhabitants of such realm have no actual physicality.
2nd dimension would be a line or a collation of points. In this aspects, each point could be a realm, world or universe (imagine that!!!)
3rd dimension would be the first plane, a triangle built by three lines composed of an indefinite number of points but bound by its outer (greater dimension)
4th dimension, would be a line bisecting the triangle and forming a solid figure. That would be our world. The figure created is a cube. this is our world, our experience.
5th dimension is composed of a hyperfigure. Friends of mine say that in such a strange land people might have 12 different bodies.
after the fifth there will naturally be a sixth, seventh and eighth. I personally believe there are sixteenth dimensional states, but that is beyond the point.
Just a thought!!!
This metric is equivalent to a co-rotating reference frame that is rotating with angular speed Ω that depends on both the radius r and the colatitudeθ, where Ω is called the Annihilation Event.
You can also munch on this investigation as well:
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0808/0808.2977v2.pdf
Thomas I beg to differ on your proposal of dimensional causation. First we might define what a dimension is. Is it a place? Awareness?Consciousness? or part of a Geometric Form?
I tend to believe that a dimension holds a seemingly infinite array of patters but is thoroughly finite and bound by yet an even greater degree of dimension. The first dimension would be Zero Space where everything is compressed and nothing is defined.
Then the 1st dimension is a point. Note that the inhabitants of such realm have no actual physicality.
2nd dimension would be a line or a collation of points. In this aspects, each point could be a realm, world or universe (imagine that!!!)
3rd dimension would be the first plane, a triangle built by three lines composed of an indefinite number of points but bound by its outer (greater dimension)
4th dimension, would be a line bisecting the triangle and forming a solid figure. That would be our world. The figure created is a cube. this is our world, our experience.
5th dimension is composed of a hyperfigure. Friends of mine say that in such a strange land people might have 12 different bodies.
after the fifth there will naturally be a sixth, seventh and eighth. I personally believe there are sixteenth dimensional states, but that is beyond the point.
Just a thought!!!
Darby
Epochal Historian
Servantx,
Thanks for the link.
No, he's not describing the Higgs Boson. He attempted a simple way to derive alpha^-1 (which he defined - the fine structure constant, 1/137). The math works out approximately correct but the math shown says nothing about the fundamental strength of the electromagnetic force.
a^-1 = e^2/c * h-bar = 1/137 where
c = speed of light
e = charge on an elecron
h-bar = Planck's Constant/2Pi
Thanks for the link.
No, he's not describing the Higgs Boson. He attempted a simple way to derive alpha^-1 (which he defined - the fine structure constant, 1/137). The math works out approximately correct but the math shown says nothing about the fundamental strength of the electromagnetic force.
a^-1 = e^2/c * h-bar = 1/137 where
c = speed of light
e = charge on an elecron
h-bar = Planck's Constant/2Pi
John Thomas
Temporal Navigator
We're speaking different languages here but I don't have a problem with your interpretation of it all.
servantx
Quantum Scribe
Thanks Darby.
Let me continue the equation from last post:
2π + (Φπ)^3 = 137.627881054
2π + (Φπ)^3 ≃ α^-1 ≃ 1/α
α ≃ 1/2π + (Φπ)^3
α ≃ 1/137.627881054
Maybe the image try to find a connection between golden spiral and fine-structure constant?
From your post:
e^2/c * ħ= α^-1= 1/α
e^2 = (1/(α * ħ)) * c
e = sqrt((1/(α * ħ)) * c)
ħ = h/2π = 1.054571726 * 10^-34 J.s (Joule seconds)
c =299792458 ms^-1
Continue equation:
e = sqrt((1/(α * ħ)) * c)
e = sqrt((1/(ħ/137)) * c)
e = sqrt((1/ ( (1.054571726 * 10^-34)/137) ) * 299792458)
e = sqrt((1/ (7.6976038 * 10^-37) ) * 299792458)
e = 1.9734793 * 10^22
Therefore e (charge on an electron) = 1.9734793 * 10^22 C (coulomb) ----> (or other units?)
That means the electrical charge on an electron is connected to fine-structure constant
Am I right? Further more:
The Planck constant was first described as the proportionality constant between the energy (E) of a photon and the frequency (ν) of its associated electromagnetic wave.
The energy of a photon with angular frequency ω, where ω = 2πν
And the infamous Einstein's equation: Mass-energy equivalence
ħω = mc^2
m = ħω / c ^ 2
m = 2ħπν / c ^ 2
Does mass have anything to do with angular frequency, Planck's Constant and speed of light?
The Higgs Boson gives all objects mass.
Transient001
Quantum Scribe
Good morning Friends of Earth TR125.0121
Everytime I think about the Higgs Boson-Mass relation I experience a joyous emotion throughout my entire being. The very concept is philosophical and utterly trascendental. I do not know if we are all aware of its wonderful implications. Imagine a relation in which things are given mass, the very concept reaches into the surface of creation.
Now, what we need to ponder is how is this mass given to every other particle?
Through what mysterious means does mass coagulates into existence?
Previous to the acquiring of mass how in what state does the particle exist?
How is the ratio of conversion between non-mass and mass?
What is the underlying force which moves the acquiring of mass?
It reminds me a lot of Plato.
Everytime I think about the Higgs Boson-Mass relation I experience a joyous emotion throughout my entire being. The very concept is philosophical and utterly trascendental. I do not know if we are all aware of its wonderful implications. Imagine a relation in which things are given mass, the very concept reaches into the surface of creation.
Now, what we need to ponder is how is this mass given to every other particle?
Through what mysterious means does mass coagulates into existence?
Previous to the acquiring of mass how in what state does the particle exist?
How is the ratio of conversion between non-mass and mass?
What is the underlying force which moves the acquiring of mass?
It reminds me a lot of Plato.
Darby
Epochal Historian
Well of course it's somehow connected to the fine grain constant. So is gravitation, the strong force and the weak force. It's called reality. The universe and its laws of nature is the universe and its laws of nature. They are all connected. We only provide seperate proofs for similar physical theories because we don't presently know enough about reality to come up with the Theory of Everything.
But kit-bashing Pi and Phi together such that the equation approximately equals alpha is trivial absent a proof. I'm sure that we all recall from our geometry classes that the teacher/professor made it very clear that the correct answer would be counted as incorrect unless the proof of how it was derived was explicitely stated.
There's a reason for that. Coming up with the "right" answer in one case while using incorrect methodology does not guarantee that in the general case the same methodology would consistently provide the correct answer. One could just as easily cast a sufficient number of dice and when the "correct" outcome came up say that s/he arrived at the right answer.
I think that the elephant in the corner that is being ignored in this conversation is the post, by the same person, immediately following the graphic and equation. That post is very telling. Because Servantx is the OP on this thread I'll leave it up to him to provide that post for review.
servantx
Quantum Scribe
Hi Darby, can you be more specific? Which post number in this thread?
I have found a video which can explain a bit more about this golden ratio in quantum world, just ignore some of the pictures in his slide show.
Pi and Phi and Fine Structure has a connection according to his theory.
I have found a video which can explain a bit more about this golden ratio in quantum world, just ignore some of the pictures in his slide show.
Pi and Phi and Fine Structure has a connection according to his theory.
servantx
Quantum Scribe
After searching for Phi and Higgs Boson, looks like the Phi in Higgs field means something else...
Secret symmetry and the Higgs boson (Part II) | plus.maths.org
Higgs constructed a model in which a quantum field (Phi) plays the role of the order parameter in Landau’s theory. He realised that if the potential energy of his new field was defined to have exactly the same form as in Landau’s theory, then it would provide a symmetry breaking mechanism that could be applied to the fundamental forces in particle physics. Higgs wrote down the following expression for this potential energy at a given point:
Here syands for the value of the field at the point.
Secret symmetry and the Higgs boson (Part II) | plus.maths.org